How to stop or solve the poverty in the Philippines?

[foolonthehill]

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The author wrote and said on the program: Even if we hv zero corruption tomorrow morning, the poor worker still be earning P265 a day when the survival wage is P600 ...

That is not the solkution...

once corruption will be minimized then poverty level goes down...

[foolonthehill]

LIAR., you say YOU VE READ THE THEORY AND YET YOU SAY BENTULAN did not hear of the big mac index?

ha ha its not BURGER index , ignorant. it is BIG MAC INDEX.

you have no credibility at all and you sound pompous. calling Hyperwage unfounded.

one chapter is devoted to the big mac index

liar evil ka.


]

I have read the theory already and had heard the discussion from the author himself Mr. Bentulan. I don't wish to put down the person behind it, but it seems he missed to see the science behind a "market-driven economy" which has been tested time and time again.



If you have read the theory well and believed it, then both of you are missing real economic concepts here. And yes, while you can't apply economic concepts most of the time, but you can apply those that are proven and tested. Thus the saying -- "If it ain't broke (accepted economic principles) why fix it?"

No.2 you and the author are not judicious in using economic data. You compare wages in affluent countries as basis why hyperwages can be applicable here. Does he know what BMI (Burger Mac Index) means? Did he ever study the impact of forex parity with reference to purchasing power between trading countries? That any adjustment in prices can dampen export markets? If he didn't, it can only mean he's just making up the theory without prudence.

No. 3 The theory plays on a skewed assumption that it will work because it invites foreign investments. This is REAL BS. How can you invite foreign investments with that if you're wages is not at par with countries offering the same job? Does your "theory" have any real data where it indicated a surge in foreign direct investment when hyperwage was applied?

I'm sorry, I don't even bite if hyperwage meets the criteria of being a theory -- it is very unintelligible, unscientific and best of it all -- it is unfounded!

[foolonthehill]

you have not read the book? it is written there that the exploitative foreign investments will go away but the good one come here.. Jollibee went to US bec of HIGH WAGES or LOW wageds? or consumer purhcasing power..

YOu have no credibility all your speculations have no basis brownprose; all false logic.

I have read the theory already and had heard the discussion from the author himself Mr. Bentulan. I don't wish to put down the person behind it, but it seems he missed to see the science behind a "market-driven economy" which has been tested time and time again.

If you have read the theory well and believed it, then both of you are missing real economic concepts here. And yes, while you can't apply economic concepts most of the time, but you can apply those that are proven and tested. Thus the saying -- "If it ain't broke (accepted economic principles) why fix it?"

No.2 you and the author are not judicious in using economic data. You compare wages in affluent countries as basis why hyperwages can be applicable here. Does he know what BMI (Burger Mac Index) means? Did he ever study the impact of forex parity with reference to purchasing power between trading countries? That any adjustment in prices can dampen export markets? If he didn't, it can only mean he's just making up the theory without prudence.

No. 3 The theory plays on a skewed assumption that it will work because it invites foreign investments. This is REAL BS. How can you invite foreign investments with that if you're wages is not at par with countries offering the same job? Does your "theory" have any real data where it indicated a surge in foreign direct investment when hyperwage was applied?

I'm sorry, I don't even bite if hyperwage meets the criteria of being a theory -- it is very unintelligible, unscientific and best of it all -- it is unfounded!

[foolonthehill]

Hyperwage Theory is NOT a theory it is a reality . all First World countries are hyperwage countries thats your relatives are there. are you hard of understanding? they didnt go there bec they like the cold. our fathers went to Saudi not bec of the hot sun but bec of high wages. your teacher went to Taiwan as maids not bec they like the language there but bec thy have high wages.

That is evidence real and historical. and have you read the Card Krueger. read it first

If you cannot understand that. then go back to your field of education dont dabble in economics.

Bro...you just said it yourself it is a "Theory" and remains to be proven. Arbitrary increase in wages has been proven to be inflationary -- and it's not a theory but supported by empirical data. Between (unproven) theory and historical evidence, would you really think anyone would buy your theory?

By the way...I have heard this theory sometime more than two years ago by Thads Bentulan (sorry if i mispelled his name)...frankly, I don't even know if he understands his economics well although I don't wish to presume an expert here but it's poor economics to ignore proven economic concepts which is what this whole theory conversely presents.

[foolonthehill]

Pareho ta bay. but i read the book and found out every assertion has a logical basis. compared to what our govt is doing now. all bad economics.

im very much convinced about this hyperwage theory..
i always listened to DYAB's aragnkada kanang kang leo lastimosa..
it was there in DYAB that i first heard about this theory and the author gamely answered all questions thrown at him.. and i was convinced..

[foolonthehill]

are you ignorant? All high wage countries have lower inflation rates than third world countries. or maybe you didnt know that bec you didnt read the book.

Read the Card-Krueger chapter it discredits your statement below.

You are very wild. you make wild statements and you think that makes ur statement correct?

Sorry...this is just too good to be true. hyper-wages is inflationary and this has been proven many times over in many economies.

[foolonthehill]

Thats what the second chapter of the book says Strategy of Poverty . we compete on low wages rather than high intellect..

that is why US never recruits our doctors to practice medicine in the US. they only recruit the nurse bec nurses work as slaves.

is the street strategist a pinoy? a bisdak? if yes, wow...awesome...

* * *

not a solution, but a grim observation:

we take pride in being an emerging BPO hub, we're happy being called the prime supplier of quality overseas worker...

yeah, isnt that great

...we're giving Bangalore a run for their money when it comes to cheap labor and high-school level careers...

...we take pride for producing the best workers the world over...guess what? so was Africa a few centuries ago (read: slave trade)...the only difference is that now, the slaves voluntarily get in the slave ships...

[foolonthehill]

You are using incomplete logic. Ayaw patuga-tuga brownprose, you are ignorant, you have no expertise in economics and you dont read the book being debated.

In the book, which i have read and which you have not...

increases in wages can be offset in the combination of these:
(kombinasyon, sister ha, para kasabot ka)

1. increase in producitivty

2. increase in selling price (consumer with purchasing power can absorb higher prices; dont forget the chapter on asymptotic inflation, ha brownprose. baka pataka na pod ka hyperinflation diha)

3. increase in sales volume (people have the consumer purchasing power due to high wages)

Combination...

This is evident in 13th month pay (double wages in one month but inflation is NOT NOT NOT double)

Depends. You might be interested to read some publications about time and motion studies on many labor-intensive jobs. If you like to get some ideas what they are, you may want to visit some Mepz companies in Lapu2x. But let me give you an example -- say in the shoe industry. Studies suggest that an average worker only has the MAXIMUM CAPACITY to produce 18-20 shoes a day. Given, do you think he/she would be extra productive if you give him/her twice his ordinary pay if he goes beyond his production capacity? Remember, humans are not machines that you can reconfigure to produce over and above his energies.

Productivity in other areas of employment works on certain jobs like sales/marketing; special or technical skills that help reduce waste or optimize loads or capacities and etc. Companies are willing to pay extra for these type of "work performances" since they help companies reduce cost or invite business.



Of course. That's why part of the risk of employment is by being substituted for machines. Workers must be prepared to learn new skills that machines cannot replace because market forces will always leverage new technologies to reduce or if not eliminate the need for humans -- another fact of life the world cannot change.

[foolonthehill]

Brownprose, you are exposing your ignorance, you lack of economic knowledge, and lying about reading the book.

the 20,000 (whether divided over 5 years or not) is an a CONSTANT CONSTANT CONSTANT PESO BASIS.

Bay, if you have not read, dont enter in the debate. if you cannot understand constant peso basis, do not enter into the debate.

bay, obvious kaayo bay that if you are an economist you will ask if the statemetn is for nominal amount or constant amount basis. so the book in one of the chapters mentions this fact that CONTANT PESO OR CONSTANT DOLLAR BASIS.

so it is false for you to claim that the author does not consider the changes in inflation.

sorry bay ha.. wala ka mangaway nimo. sayop lang gyod ka and you are so arrogant about it by discrediting other people with your false statemetns.

I read that 20% yearly increment proposed by Bentulan. Effectively, five years hence, the minimum wage would be like 3.5 times already. And the same increment would consequently follow on goods and services. In effect, it doesn't offer any change in the purchasing power.



Yes BUT on a case by case or industry by industry basis. There are prosperous industries like IT. In Silicon Valley for example, even small companies can afford to really pay high as much as they can afford to hire just one or two people to do programming (I know this because I am also currently connected with a Silicon Valley firm now). But it's hard to ignore the fact that there are industries that require physical labor that a company dies without such kind of human resource -- small scale mining, low-rise construction, system integration/installation and etc.



Do you know how many small businesses this country has? According to the DTI, more than 98% of the country's businesses are categorized as SMEs (Small-Medium Enterprises). Would you or can you afford to make such big trade-offs? I don't think so.

[foolonthehill]

BrownProse,
did you even read the book? There is an analysis there of teh effect of Hyperwage and rice prices , precisely your concern below. about rice, veggies etc.

Read it daw bay as a favor to us, then cut and paste the example there so you will know what we are talking about.

If you have not read that chapter, what have you chapter have u read?

Pait bay if we are not debating with the same subject.

miga ta bay ha. basa lang sa god.

And even if it is forced to, and assuming for the sake of discussion that a sari sari store can afford to make such a huge raise, it will also be forced to raise prices of his isda, utanon and etc. so the moment your worker gets his "hyper-raise", he still has to pay more for the isda and utanon eventually making hyperwage very meaningless and pointless. And what about those that don't have jobs at all?