Legalize Abortion?

[giddyboy]

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I see, because from the past threads, the problem presented was "overpopulation and poverty" and the RH bill is the solution. So it is safe to say that this RH bill is not really meant to solve poverty and the much abused concept of overpopulation. Anyway, I don't believe that the RH bill will help cutting poverty or "overpopulation" in anyway.

The RH Bill does not claim that family planning is the panacea for poverty. It simply recognizes the correlation between population and poverty (and perhaps education and poverty too). The bigger the family size a couple has, the bigger tendency also they will be more vulnerable to poverty incidence.

Poverty is caused by a web of correlated factors. Unemployment/underemployment is one. that's why the gov't has to address it. Corruption is one. that's why the gov't has to also solve this. Lack of education is also one. Lack of family planning is also one. etc etc blah blah blah.

besides, health is everybody's concern. health is a gov't concern. Buang gyud cguro ang gobyerno nga dili mogasto para sa health sa mga tawo, di ba? just because you think health welfare cannot solve poverty means wala nlng diay program ang gov't pertaining to health?

Reproductive health welfare and rights is an integral part of the General Health welfare and rights that almost all of us here are concerned with.

Ok let me just point out one issue.
(4) Prevention of abortion and management of post-abortion complications
Abortion is a crime in our country. What is this management of post-abortion complications? Does this include persecuting the abortionist? Or this already mean consenting to abortion undermining our constitution?

Management of Post-abortion complications means management of post-miscarriages. A miscarriage is called spontaneous abortion: Miscarriage is the most common complication of early pregnancy. Another management is pertaining about ectopic pregnancy.

Emergency abortion used to treat ectopic pregnancies is legal and in no way immoral as it is meant to save the life of the mother in life-threatening situations.

NO TO ABORTION! YES TO THE REPRODUCTIVE HEALTH BILL!

[giddyboy]

We have to remember that the RH bill is being used as a vehicle to sneak in abortion to the Philippines. The foreign backers of this bill believe abortion is a "right". Therefore, it is not surprising that they try to slowly undermine our nation's legal and social defenses against abortion.

so you are now turning this forum into a malicious hate thread against foreigners diay ha. That's i think Racial profiling u r doing there my friend. You are also putting your morality higher than those foreigners. unsay tanaw diay nimo nila, mga Satanas? That's Demonizing, Reductio ad hitlerum, and Red herring tactic as they would like to call it. how do u know for sure that the RH Bill is being used as a vehicle to sneak in abortion to the Phils? Because the Bill is supported by EU and some EU countries have legalized abortion and could somehow "infect" us? gibogo-an nlng gyud ka sa mga Pinoy tingali noh or perhaps gihugawan nlng gyud ka aning foreigners noh?
(kung buot huna-hunaon, kung dili tungod ani nila, Muslim unta ka karon!)

let me ask you this: what really is the difference between a pharmacy dispensing condoms and contraceptives as compared to a public health center dispensing the same? source of funds di ba? pharmacy funds came from private money, public health center funds came from taxpayer's money di ba?

nya ngano moangal man ang simbahan ug using taxpayer's money nga wala man nagabayad ang simbahan gani ug buhis in the first place?

Bwahaha! Get back to your history. The Catholic Church NEVER had a dogma that the world was flat. Where in the world do you get your absurd and inaccurate ideas?

bwahahaha. i know that is just a myth. what i meant is the Galileo affair. i got it the other way around.

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you have to remember that in Ireland for example, which has the same provision in its Constitution with ours protecting the "unborn", stating that:
"The State acknowledges the right to life of the unborn and, with due
regard to the equal right to life of the mother, guarantees in its laws to
respect, and, as far as practicable, by its laws to defend and vindicate
that right." (Article 40, Sec. 3.3)

Despite this provision, the Irish government funds and delivers all modern contraceptive methods (DHC-Ireland), including IUDs, pills, injectables and implants (IFPA). In the case of the Phils., contraceptives are only available in pharmacies lately.

Evidence-based information from health authorities clearly state that IUDs and hormonal contraceptives are not abortifacients based on their mechanisms of action. A position paper by the UNDP/UNFPA/WHO/World Bank Special Programme of Research, Development and Research Training in Human Reproduction (2006 November) on a 2006 House Bill on "Abortive Substances and Devices" clearly stated
that hormonal contraceptives and IUDs "cannot be labelled as abortifacients", that doing so "contradict both WHO's evidence-based international standards on the mechanisms of action and the drug and device labelling in the WHO Model List of Essential Medicines."

Even the lactational amenorrhea method (LAM, or FP through full breastfeeding) affects the endometrium in a way that may hypothetically interfere with implantation. Labeling such effects on the endometrium as abortion will lead to the absurd conclusion that breastfeeding causes abortions.

You see, Contraceptives are systematically reviewed and chosen carefully by an Expert Committee of the WHO on the basis of priority health care needs, efficacy, safety and cost-effectiveness. The entire Contraceptives Subgroup was systematically reviewed from 2006-2007, triggered by the Expert Committee's decision not to list several contraceptive medicines in 2005 (WHO, 2007, p. 4. The review resulted in the retention of all previously listed contraceptives and the addition of two new products for the 2007 list (WHO Reviewer No. 1; WHO, 2007, pp. 50-52)

The latest list of the WHO (2007, p. 109) include the most common oral contraceptive pills and injectables, the copper-containing IUD, condoms, diaphragms and one type of implantable contraceptive. They are all classified by the WHO under the subgroup "Contraceptives":

Oral hormonal contraceptives - ethinylestradiol + levonorgestrel, ethinylestradiol + norethisterone, levonorgestrel

Injectable hormonal contraceptives - medroxyprogesterone acetate, medroxyprogesterone acetate +
estradiol cypionate,norethisterone enantate

Intrauterine devices - copper-containing device

Barrier methods - condoms, diaphragms

Implantable contraceptives - levonorgestrel-releasing implant

[joshua259]

Sipyat bro or tinoyoan ang pagkamabdos? Kung sipyat, aw mao nay example sa pagka walay gamit aning RH bill.

ngek... nganong imo mang apilon ang RH bill? nga human error man ang nahitabo... hahaha why man mangita og lusot para ma blame ang RH bill? tinu-od careless akoang uyab pero dili na pasabot kay tungod walay gamit ang RH bill. FYI sad my son is very health little boy and i have no regrets about it.

ad baya ni mr. mannyamador kay "The Pill Kills".

[cypher86]

if you say err on the side of caution, meaning we should not use contraceptives, even a condom, it also means you are also prejudging and accusing the pharma companies of dispensing contraceptives nga mkapa abort diay.

it also simply means you cannot force people to err on side of caution your way coz some people also think that to err on the side of caution is to use contraceptives like the condom and the pill. you cannot force people to use only NFP mannyboy! wake up from your little world!

I understand what your trying to say, but I think what manny said was that, when it comes to matters that deal with human life (the parasite that grows in the womb for 9 months) We must "err on the side of caution" so as not to inadvertently cause the unborn parasite to be killed.

[gikapoy]

wai gamit nang abortion oi
ang mga dato kai gamay raman anak
kasagaran naa sa lower class mao man daghan anak. murag dili tingali sila ka afford pa abort. wala man gali halos pang kaun. mag gasto2x pa sila pa abort

[giddyboy]

I understand what your trying to say, but I think what manny said was that, when it comes to matters that deal with human life (the parasite that grows in the womb for 9 months) We must "err on the side of caution" so as not to inadvertently cause the unborn parasite to be killed.

coz that's because he based "conception" from the definition of pro-lifers and his borrowed articles which is during fertilization when the sperm meets the egg. they even went as far as saying that the use of condoms is against nature. so that means to err on the side of caution is we should not even use condoms daw. but some would argue that is not the case coz even during menstruation, many fertilized egg fail to implant on the uterus. so if we follow their logic, many fertilized eggs were unintentionally aborted diay during menstruation. but of course they would argue that death is a natural phenomenon.

actually, the term "to err on the side of caution" was borrowed from a priest who was a member of the Constitutional Commission who made the 1987 Consti. I even wonder why a priest is included in making our Constitution. the exact term he used then was "play it safe". and even though our Consti did not specifically say "moment of conception" is during fertilization, he wants us to "assume" that it is.

other definition of "conception" is not during fertilization but during implantation when the fertilized egg attaches itself to the uterus. but of course, pro-life groups would insist the definition is arbitrary.

Pro-life groups even consider invitro-fertilization as committing abortion. they insist that childless couples should only adopt children as compared to having a test tube baby. they even went as far as calling the use of condoms "preemptive abortion".

[giddyboy]

ngek... nganong imo mang apilon ang RH bill? nga human error man ang nahitabo... hahaha why man mangita og lusot para ma blame ang RH bill? tinu-od careless akoang uyab pero dili na pasabot kay tungod walay gamit ang RH bill. FYI sad my son is very health little boy and i have no regrets about it.

mao gyud. wala pa gani nahimong law ang proposed RH Bill, gi blame na nuon daan?

[giddyboy]

wai gamit nang abortion oi
ang mga dato kai gamay raman anak
kasagaran naa sa lower class mao man daghan anak. murag dili tingali sila ka afford pa abort. wala man gali halos pang kaun. mag gasto2x pa sila pa abort

don't be confused and misled to what some perpetrators have been doing in this thread. Nobody here is for legalizing abortion. The only exception here is if it involves emergency life-threatening situations.

but some quarters here want to equate using birth control pills, and the IUD as committing abortion. they also do not want us to use the condom. The proposed Reproductive Health (RH) Bill promotes natural and modern family planning methods that are legally permissible and medically safe, that's why these quarters i mentioned (including the church) wants also to label the bill as promoting abortion daw. why? they only want us to follow the natural way of family planning which is abstinence.

But that is not the case w/ a lot of Congressmen including Sen. Manny Villar and Chiz Escudero. They support the RH Bill. to add, accdg to Pulse Asia, 6 out of 10 Pinoys support the RH Bill. The intention of the bill is to make the LGU's RH program national & comprehensive in scope. coz under our present setup, is still not.

[simonjed]

hmmm daghan kaau pros ug cons ning abortion...dapat unta b4 magtuga2 maghuna2 unta kong unsay effect sa gbuhat...sorry kung na OT ko..

[giddyboy]

ngiga ani ng propaganda wui. i wonder if this has passed PANA truth in advertising.

no matter how desperate you are w/ all those dirty propaganda and your "March for Life" prayer rally yesterday, you cannot erase the fact that RH Bill supporters outnumber the critics.

instead of giving direct info, your slogan type black and covert propaganda technique confuses and misleads more people instead. it brings more questions instead of answers. for example: to whom does the pill kill? the one who took the pill? what type of pill is the slogan talking about? abortion pill, contraceptive pill, ecstacy or what?

but of course, sa kadugay na nko dre sa thread, i know what desired result you are cooking up to further a political agenda: a smear campaign against the RH Bill, and, op kors, more membership to your lobbyist org.

AFAIK, medical and scientific evidence shows that all the possible medical risks connected with birth control pills are infinitely lower than the risks of an actual pregnancy and everyday activities. The risk of dying within a year of using pills is 1 in 200,000 as compared to the risk of dying within a year of riding a car is 1 in 5,900, or compared to the risk of dying from a pregnancy is 1 in 10,000. The pill is even used by some in therapeutic treatments for other illnesses.

this slogan is a brief, striking phrase that includes labeling and stereotyping. This technique attempts to arouse prejudices in an audience by labeling the object of the propaganda campaign as something the target audience fears, hates, loathes, or finds undesirable.

BASIN NEXT TIME NATO MAKITA diri is a slogan: "THE CONDOM KILLS!"

NO TO ABORTION! YES TO THE REPRODUCTIVE HEALTH BILL!