MERGED: MILF-GRP Peace Process, Related Issues and Developments

[Faeries]

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Nobody wants war but if you are left with no choice then you just have to. Its all politics, by that i mean is all about POWER.

If the MILF are willing to negotiate they have to be a little decent and start being responsible for their supposed rogue commanders. They have to start acting to a level whom our government can talk and trust and not a group that will stab us when we turn our back at them.

This not "utak-pulbura" talking, but I think the government should be a little wary and cautious in dealing with the MILF, I honestly dont see why the government should trust them.

[Faeries]

consider the following:

• humanitarian cost: how many civilians can die and will be displaced because of this? hundreds of thousands.
• financial cost: money spent on medicines and schools now spent on guns and ammunition. who will benefit for the billions of pesos worth of expenses?
• political cost: it will not just be the MILF you will be waging war against, but an entire people. can we risk a genocide?

the MILF is but a manifestation of the underlying issues of the Bangsamoro that need to be addressed. we can try to annihilate each and every MILF member out there, but since we have not eliminated the root-cause of the entire problem, another group is bound to emerge in MILF's place.

and how certain are we that this group will become suicide bombers a la Al Quaeda, this time blowing up buildings in major urban centers like Manila and yes, Cebu?

it's called 'radicalization'. do we risk this scenario?

Actually, I've read somewhere that in history of suicide bombers If I remember it right only one Filipino was able to do it, although there indonesians and of middle eastern suicide bombers. There was one incident though in mindanao that a supposed middle eastern suicide bomber did it so encourage more filipinos to suicide bombers but it was a futile act.

Base on the Filipino culture - across religion- applicable to moros, catholic, aetas etc. we tend to be more sociable and more close to our families. We tend to be happy, and we cant keep secrets.

We tend to have strong support groups than other nationalities. And our Women are given more respect, so mothers tend to check on their sons and daughters.

[yacky2006]

GRP-MILF draft pact on Bangsamoro homeland
http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/inquire...amoro-homeland

[Nelson28]

sakto jud ka sir....wala na silay sala daan..kung magkina unsa....

[higanstolsdawen]

I'm quite surprised that the Army have just deployed the Rangers and LRUs just now when they should've been at the tip of the spear...

He said the group may still be able to flee considering the topography of the area.

The statement in red above appears to be nanghunaw daan si Oban in case wa silay madakpan/mapatay na MILF...

sakto jud ka bosing nanghunaw na daan si Oban kay nakaipsot man ang usa sa ilang high value target.

Abdusalam and several of his men reportedly slipped through the cordon of the government forces with the troops seizing two .50 caliber machine guns at the encampment.

Military declares victory in Sibugay - The Philippine Star » News » Headlines

[gareb]

interesting comments as usual.

@hush232002:in the end of every battle the victor's like of reasoning is always right. we can focus less on the Sri Lankan government's propaganda and focus more on the humanitarian casualties of the entire conflict from the start. a quick check on Wikipedia tell of up to 100,000 killed in the entire duration of the conflict. this does not include the internally displaced families.

can we afford something like this in Mindanao? most certainly not.

@Faeries:

1. Are you saying that as a sovereign state our troops are not allowede to enter certain areas within our sovereign territory?

perhaps you fail to realize that we are engaged in a armed conflict here that has so far until recently been abated due to compromise agreements that the MILF and the GRP had with each other. this is the nuances about the peace process that i have been talking about for a number of times now.

the issue here is not about sovereignty as this is one of the main points of contention between both parties. GRP insists on sovereignty over the entire archipelago while MILF fights for a separate state in certain areas.

the issue here is upholding previous agreements. the GRP and the MILF had an agreement about "areas of temporary stay". if the AFP/GRP has any problems with it with reported cases of certain elements (Abu Sayyaf) seeking refuge on these areas since they are supposedly "AFP-proof", then the AFP/GRP should file a formal complaint on the peace panel.

any unilateral action, may it be from the AFP/GRP or the MILF, outside the peace process jeopardizes any chance of achieving peace at all.

2. Found posted by another, was able to read this also in a newspaper, This belies their claim that it was a renegade MILF

for the sake of argument, let us just say that these were not rogue elements of the MILF. why was the AFP "attacking" when there was suppose to be a ceasefire in place?

if we are going to take this news article as true, does this mean that the AFP violated the ceasefire agreement and attacked first?

3. Yes. Assuming that what they are saying is true that it was indeed renegade commanders and faction it only shows that MILF has no control over its members, or maybe it just very convenient for them to say "oh its a rogue commander we should not be blame for it."

Why should we talk with a supposed entity that has no control over its members?

you are quite right. it is a convenient excuse. saying that it is a "rogue commander" or a "lost command" also shields their negotiating position with the GRP. it is an obvious tactic that they employ to preserve their position; declare a unit a "lost command" if it does something that is not sanctioned by the central authority.

however both the MILF and the GRP peace panels know that this cannot be sustained for a long time; the MILF will simply run out of people and will lose its bargaining position if it has too many "lost commands".

4. You said that FATAH and HAMAS are at war with each other. Is there now a faction within the MILF? NO. They are not even willing to surrender these rogue commanders.

In my point of view they like to project an image that they are distinct with each other but that truth is they came from one source.

perhaps you might not have heard of them pointing their guns at each other. there are always political factions within an organization. how deep the divide goes is yet to be known. but you have to also understand that the MILF is not a homogeneous body; it is comprised of several tribes, mainly the Maguindanao, the Tausug, the Maranaos and others.

of course they come from one source, and conflicts such as what we are seeing seeing now proves to galvanize the tribes.

[lestat1116]

Abdusalam and several of his men reportedly slipped through the cordon of the government forces with the troops seizing two .50 caliber machine guns at the encampment.

--- 2 .50 cal mao na ni part sa 5m gihatag?

[b1 huck]

naunsa naman ni amung lugar sa sibugay uy... kumusta na kaha akong lolo didto..

[gareb]

Are you trying to say that there is a distinction between "Bangsamoros" and Filipinos?

I beg to disagree with that there are two distinct nations in the Philippines you are disregarding the fact that there are also tribes in LUzon and Visayaz region. We do have to consider them also distinct nation from the supposed "nation" created during the Spanish period and so after that.

it really depends on how you define what "nation" is. a tribal group can be a "nation" on its own if its development as a society has little or no commonalities or shared history with the other groups around it, and if it has retained a distinct culture (religion and language included)

how scholars see the Bangsamoro nation as distinct from the Filipino nation is best summarized by Prof. David in his article "Solidarity amid difference". i am including here excerpts, highlights mine:

If you were a Moro who grew up in Mindanao, you would be telling stories of how your ancestors defended their homes against waves of invaders who tried to subjugate them and take away their lands. If you were a Filipino, you might have been told stories of how your ancestors tried to protect their communities against foreign invaders but failed in the face of superior arms.

The Moros have not forgotten their struggles against outsiders because they have always resisted being ruled by others. Filipinos on the other hand have generally forgotten that they became Filipinos in the context of colonial subjugation. This is the basic difference between our two nations. One imagines itself permanently engaged in a battle to remain free. The other takes for granted its sovereignty over the territory left behind by the former colonial rulers.

We Filipinos tell the story of our nation as a narrative of resistance, subjugation and oppression, and revolt and emancipation. Moros tell theirs as a narrative of relentless resistance. In their eyes they have always been free and self-governing. It is ironic that we persist in treating them as an inferior people even as we sometimes draw from the richness of Moro culture to define the roots of our pre-colonial being. They know that though we may be sprung from the same racial stock, we are the cousins who fell under colonialism and whose children were formed in the image of the colonizers. History made us different from each other, and today we continue to fight over how we should live together.

The Moro problem is not a problem of political integration and social assimilation. It is rooted rather in our failure to recognize difference,and to multiply those opportunities in which we can mutually think of one another as sharing similar intentions in a land that by accident we commonly inhabit. This is a slow painstaking process. We cannot begin to solve the problem by self-righteously asserting the inviolability of our constitution and proving this by the might of our army. Our constitution has not protected or benefited the Moros; they are right to reject it. And no army can end this problem unless it is prepared to commit genocide.

[gareb]

Actually, I've read somewhere that in history of suicide bombers If I remember it right only one Filipino was able to do it, although there indonesians and of middle eastern suicide bombers. There was one incident though in mindanao that a supposed middle eastern suicide bomber did it so encourage more filipinos to suicide bombers but it was a futile act.

Base on the Filipino culture - across religion- applicable to moros, catholic, aetas etc. we tend to be more sociable and more close to our families. We tend to be happy, and we cant keep secrets.

We tend to have strong support groups than other nationalities. And our Women are given more respect, so mothers tend to check on their sons and daughters.

you are right one all points and it is something that is very commendable about us. despite challenges of modern society, family is still a major driving force in our society.

but the radicalization that i am talking about happens in the aftermath of the war; when families have been torn, lives broken and lost, livelihoods and lands rendered useless. hopelessness and rage reigns; the prime ingredients for radicalization.

the question then is not if we are capable of suicide bombings, but will we allow a situation that would produce radicals?