sign of progress

[fingolfin]

---

i'd rather trust the a positive change in statistics (employment, inflation, poverty incidence, economic sector growth, job security, rise in wages, etc. ) as a sign of progress, than winning the bid to sponsor the F1, or even the Olympics for that matter. =)

.. oh c'mon gareb, don't be so superficial here. That's why i gave it a title, Sign of Progress coz hosting a major sporting event isn't that easy, especially F1 and you mentioned it, the Olympics. And going back to F1, in it's calendar, the countries that are hosting are the one's with financial stability and better government. Bernie Ecclestone is branching out to countries which are on the rise. First it was Malaysia, then Turkey, then China, then Singapore and now India. Can't you see the trend here ?? oh well, i guess you didn't cared to read the lead post. you failed to read my quiry to why other asian countries are leaving the philippines behind in terms of economic development.

[raddiboy]

India's economy is fast rising now... its not because theyre smarter but it seems theyre attracting lots of investors.. maybe we should take a look at their present leadership. Also the same thing happens in China. I have a chinese friend who once told me that their economic growth is so fast that its own people are having difficulty catching up with it...

Fing, political stability might be the cause, one of the areas which as of the moment we might not achieve...and we have lots of insurgency problems and unsolved killings..and we are one of the most corrupt in Asia

about F1, lisud mo compromise ang Ferrari og McLaren diri... basin ang DPWH aspalto napuy himoon para sa roadtrack...

[vern]

I agree with fin here. The right to host any sporting event means commitment to many things financial, infrastructure, etc. ... which directly relate to gareb's positive change in statistics ... not in all issues ... but in many. China for example according to TIME Magazine will be spending 28 billion dollars on things directly related to the upcoming olympics ... that says a lot about "statistics" although sadly things like this doesn't directly benefit those that need help the most. That commitment however is the product of many different factors owed to progress.

[The_Child]

F1 --- makakaon ang mga tawong gigutom ana? so how could that be progress? A bourgeiois progress. but the bourgeoisis is merely a fraction to the whole population consisting mostly of the marginalized. is this progress?

[gareb]

fingolfin:

i will not try and contend with the fact that the countries that you have mentioned might be on the verge of prosperity; each of those countries have unique socio-economic settings that may not be similar with that which we have, hence their 'solutions' might also not apply to our own problems. political stability isn't even something that can be said for either turkey or india; islamic fundamentalism encroaching on the mainstream politics in the former and bitter factionalism in the latter.

while you are more concerned of the correlation of supposed progress between winning the bid to host an event like this, i on the other hand wanted to express my dissatisfaction with being the venue for an F1 event as a 'sign of progress'. i wanted a more concrete sign, hence the presentation of positive economic statistics as a sign of progress in lieu of what you presented.

for sure i read the article that you linked. it's one brownie point for india who has always wanted to be acknowledged as a significant regional power for some decades now. but to say that this is a sign of progress is to ignore the possibility that such significant international event can happen but no equally significant progress that people benefit from is actually taking place. vern conveniently mentioned the poverty of india and how the people of china may not be able to benefit directly from the government's investments for the upcoming olympics.

what is a fact is that a country actually meeting its commitments in these events is even more important than any economic indicator for such events to take place. the economic performance of a country might suggest how easy a country can meet those commitments, though it does not necessarily mean that those whose economies are performing poorly can never meet theirs.

[ichor_82283]

If the "Sign of progress" is to be related with hosting the F1 race, then we would be agreeing to an american friend of mine that says, "at least your country has McDonald's". Are these really the sign of a progressive country? I strongly agree that the best indicators of progress are those the economists look upon which always affects the pockets of everybody- inflation rate, debt portfolio, wage/salary increase, low cost of living, the per capita, etc.

I do as well agree that when complaints of unaddressed needs are minimized, then then there is progress. Yet, I am not thoroughly convinced of that was shown on TV commercial - the one thats says "may ginhawa" when you have an OFW relative. It does not necessarily reflect the whole of the Juan dela Cruz's. It does effectively convey that we are moving forward just because we have an OFW breadwinner. True, we are dependent on the dollars of our modern heroes. True, they helped a lot in our economy. Does their help and "progress" really reflects you and me?

On the matter of political stability, it does affect our moving forward. Duh, politics isn't always stable. I mean, it's part of running the government, but yet, I don't condone it. I am just stating the other face of the coin.

What is there then in a slow progressing country that progressive country overlooked? Well, they have tapped our resources (even labor and intellect). So what else?

I think we ought to have the answer.

[baron]

^ I guess they just have their time. These developed countries were once developing in the past. But since they are older than us, they were able to develop to reach this progressive state.

As of now, we are reaching levels of maturity in terms of economic development. We are on the right path. If only we can sustain this positive trend, we can reach our goal of becoming a developed country.

[baby_grace]

At least we are on the path of growth and we are no longer stalled at a stage wherein the country could hardly gain positive economic developments. I think we passed that stage where almost every knowledgeable Filipino watches news of how the Peso goes down everyday, watching a series of increases in every commodity.

Signs of progress could be relative. Some people may have attained individual progress whereas others have not. But generally, I think we are progressing, albeit slowly.

[ichor_82283]

Signs of progress could be relative. Some people may have attained individual progress whereas others have not. But generally, I think we are progressing, albeit slowly.

It seems vague to me when you say that sign of progress (economic progress) is relative. Unsaon na lang nato pag- gauge sa atong mga economic indicators if relative na sila?
You said generally, you think we are progressing. asay naka-relative ana?

To the ish.

Couldn't we find ways to be less dependent on import demands? and be export-based country? We know that we're one of the leading exporters of labor, could their be some way to address this.

If only we come closer to what Japan has done before. They closed their country and opened to a select traders (countries and markets) to improve their economy and later opened to the world-market when they were ready.

@baron

I agree to your point that they were older than us (in terms of governments and economy), the reason why they are more advanced than us.

[raddiboy]

At least we are on the path of growth and we are no longer stalled at a stage wherein the country could hardly gain positive economic developments. I think we passed that stage where almost every knowledgeable Filipino watches news of how the Peso goes down everyday, watching a series of increases in every commodity.

Signs of progress could be relative. Some people may have attained individual progress whereas others have not. But generally, I think we are progressing, albeit slowly.

-a 9 peso increase in daily minimum wage, making it 250 in a year..
-professionals opting to work abroad because the salary they earn here for a month is equivalent to 2 days work..
-doctors who goes abroad working as nurse..
-newly graduated students working as domestic helpers or plant utilities in hongkong and emirates...

sign of progress??.. Dont believe in what PGMA says based on her statistics.. better believe in what you see around you.....