MERGED: Do You Want U.S. Statehood For the Philippines?

[vern]

---

bro, what youre illustrating is the middle class of america. they are america's workers. but what you need to look at is the upper class, becuz they're the ones calling the shots. look at the CEOs, think-tanks, politicians (rumsfeld, wolfowitz, etc...). they are the ones creating policy and claiming the majority of the profits thereof. do they look japanese-americans, iraqi-americans, african-americans to you? it's very comfortable in america, and that's why most non-whites are satisfied with the illusion created by the hegemony. you have to look at american foreign policy and business interests in the philippines under a microscope. obviously you haven't visited the mining towns in benguet or bukidnon. before you jump head on to your love affair with the u.s., please visit these places because they're run by american corporations.

they're not your saviors, bro... and we certainly are not their 'little brown brothers' (unless you want to be one, but that's another matter all together ).

Exactly my point. You can hate American policy, but mental slave is hating America itself. You should first read what I was replying to. Do you really think that the entire United States upper class is composed entirely of Caucasians? The majority are, because non-whites are the minority. But that doesn't mean that there is a less chance for a non-white to make it big. There is less racism and prejudice in America than what you make America out to be. You talk about American policy as if you have done extensive research on the subject... which I doubt. I haven't seen the mining towns you talk about, but this doesn't have anything to do with American foreign policy. They maybe run by American corporations, but what country can say that they haven't had their share of corrupt corporations? These American corporations that you talk about only own 40% of these mining operations at most. Any company that extracts and makes use of Philippine resources has to be 60% Filipino owned. You make it seem like there is nothing we can do. If these corporations are treating Filipinos so bad, why do we let them continue? They are after all ... on Philippine soil. It is more the Philippine politicians at fault than anything else. If people want change in the Philippines, they have to be part of that change. People have to stop whining of what happened years ago. It is wise to learn from the past ... but not live in it. What is important is the present ... the present is where we can change things for the better. What I feel for America is certainly not a love a fair. I'd call it appreciation and maybe a little gratitude. Gratitude for the great Filipino leaders and gratitude for what has made the Philippines what it is today because like it or not ... the Philippines is a lot better off that the majority of the world. I think it'd be appropriate to end with this ...

All human beings want happiness, but they don’t know how to go about it. They don’t even know that there is work to be done and a discipline to be observed in order to obtain it. They think that just because they are here on earth they only need to eat, drink, sleep, earn a living, and bring children into the world, and they should automatically be happy. But animals do pretty much the same things, so what is the difference? To be on earth is no guarantee of happiness. . . think

If you want happiness, don’t just sit there and do nothing about it. You must go out and start looking for the elements that nourish it, and as these elements belong to the divine world, that is where you have to look for them. Once you find them, you will love everyone and everything and be loved in return; you will understand things better, and you will have the power to create and achieve your aspirations.

-- Omraam Michael Aivanhov

[dirk]

this is a good start... now you're making more sense and sound more intellectual. are you in america now? i will assume that you are since you sound very americanized. what do you do? where do you live? i will assume further that you are among the upper middle class, since you seem very content of the present american system. maybe a doctor, engineer, or manager. further, i will also assume that you live in the coastal regions in the u.s., maybe l.a., san fran, ny city, chicago, virginia beach, or any other large city for this matter. why do you live here? can you just as easily live in small town america, in the mid west or the south? answer is no. why? because of racism. racism is still very much a part of american life. and this racism is directly connected to american foreign policy. what do you think happens to the precious metals taken from our mountains? do we profit? answer is again no. the elements the americans, the europeans, and australians mine go straight to their own national vaults. if you cannot do anything about this abuse, how can you expect the philippine politicians to do the same? answer is the majority of the philippines is still colonized mentally. and that is where your debt of gratitude comes from. this is the reason no one is doing anything about it. utang nang loob for what? if you can outline your reasons for this gratitude, i will explain further for you.

[vern]

I'm not in America now. I'm in Cebu. I'm a student. I'm 20. What does that have anything to do with it? And no when I lived in the US, I did not live in the West Coast. I lived in Minnesota ... Hibbing, Minnesota ... Zip Code 55746 ... population around 30,000. Racism exists as a part of life in all parts of the world ... but saying that racism is a part of American policy is misleading and incorrect. You will never be able to stop racism because people will always have their individual beliefs, but how in the world can you say racism is part of American foreign policy? Racism towards what? towards whom?

Does the Philippines profit from the precious materials? Why don't you ask that to the Filipinos who partly own those mines. How do Filipinos not profit? You may not get any benefit from the mining ... but more likely than not ... a certain few get a lot of money from it. In the Philippines, the rich get richer ... the poor get poorer. You cannot say the Philippine politicians can't do anything about abuse thats happening (if there is any). This is the Philippines, not the any other country ... they have all the power they need to do what has to be done. If abuse is done and Philipppine politicians do nothing about it, it is their fault that those abuses are being commited. I any case ... if there are any abuses that are being done in the mining areas ... what does this have anything to do with American foreign policy which you say has so much racism. You put too much faith in the honesty of Philippine politicians and businessmen. Honesty is rare in the highest ranks of the Philippines ... as it is in many other countries.

[dirk]

Now this makes much more sense, you're only a mere boy. You're a Fil-Am, that has returned to the Philippines, bringing with you all things from the U.S., even American thought. I don't blame your optimism of America, you have been brought up by MTV. But, you are obviously confused about Americans and American policy towards the rest of the world. I agree with you that most Americans are very good people. I have many friends from Australia, the U.S., and Europe who work with our organizations, they are from Greenpeace, Amnesty Int'l, UNICEF, etc. This isn't just a Filipino problem, it's an Int'l one.

As for racism in American policy allow me to explain further. As I've noted, the ones who directly affect foreign policy are not your Chinese-American, African-American, Latino friends, the ones who make the big decisions are all Anglo-Saxon rich males (i.e. Rumsfeld, Bush, etc.) who have a foot hold in Amercan society. Going back to the mines in the philippines, if they are responsible for abuse and extensive pollution (and this has been documented thru various NGOs and the UN) shouldn't the American gov't regulate its own entities? thousands upon thousands of complaints have been submitted to the U.S. State Dept., but they have chosen not to do anything. this is foreign policy. Why is America good inside America, but treat the rest of the world as a mere place to procure natural resources? Home Depot, the american hardwear store, gets 90% of its wood from Indonesia, effectively contributing to this nation's deforestation dilemma. the U.S. has been treating the whole Gulf Region in the middle east as a big dumb gasoline station, sucking up oil, while effectively manipulating politics in the region to guarantee this 'interest'. It is American policy to suck up the rest of the world's natural resources, becuz the U.S. population is the biggest consumer nation in the world. the not caring about what happens to people, their environment, and their way of life is RACISM. This hyper consumer culture began two centuries ago in America. to satiate this unnatural hunger, they've employed slaves to produce. American policy has been justified thru 'manifest destiny', in which millions of Native Americans were annihilated, to make way for american consumption. It spread thru Hawaii, where the Dole and Del monte corporations, effectively 'acquired' what was supposed to be a sovereign nation. To the 'benevolent' assumption of the philippines. American policy dates back a few century, and it's nothing new. What has changed is the sublty of the policy, not the purpose. This is why mining abuses is American racism.

You are only 20, so hopefully you'll get a chance to understand the truth. individual racism is found everywhere, but it becomes a tragedy when racism is policy. remember the civil rights movement erupted only a generation ago, and it is still being fought. Not many filipinos care about this becuz all they want to do is go to the U.S. They have no time to critically investigate their current predicament. What they suffer from is cultural and historical amnesia. This is why filipinos are such great workers, becuz they've forgotten. You're only 20, I encourage you to remember. Our fate as a people rest on it.



"Then a new era began for the Filipinos. Little by little they lost their ancient traditions, the memory of their past. They forgot their writing, their songs, their poems, their laws, in order to learn by rote alien teachings they did not understand: a morality and an aesthetics different from those the race had inherited from its climate and ways of feeling. They went into decline, belittling themselves in their own eyes. They became ashamed of what was their own and their nation's in order to admire and praise whatever was foreign and unintelligible. Their spirit became dejected and surrendered."

Jose Rizal, Filipinas Dentro de Cien Anos (1889)

[vern]

Now you take age against me? I doubt you have been as part of history that you illustrate as you think you are. When you find your assumption, that I comes from a big west coast city is wrong, you take age against me. An observer in history would realize that the majority of non-Caucasians that could have been in politics today are not even eligible for any public office. A couple generations ago, most Chinese immigrants could not speak English, and you expect that same generation or their sons running for public office? African Americans do hold public office ... and they hold public office everywhere. Last time I looked, Colin Powell was black.

The US does regulate their own entities ... but these companies you are talking about are international corporations ... many of which are incorporated here in the Philippines. The Philippine government has the full power and jurisdiction to regulate these entities. Why wait for American push?

There is no doubt that the US population is the biggest consumer, but saying that the US doesn't care, and racism is the way of life is generalizing. Would you agree with the statement "all Filipinos live in trees"? I think not. Lets not generalize. What a few companies do ... or what the government does ... does not represent the entire population ... even the entire government. You make the Native American conflicts seem like a conspiracy to destroy those who weren't white. That 19th century doctirine gave them the "duty" and "right" to expand throughout North America. It didn't say anything about killing Native Americans along the way was important to that end. This has nothing to do with the world today. They were what you describe the US of today to be. Times change. You speculate on American policy making it seem like fact. All this has been is ... conspiracy theory. Yes the civil rights movement is still being fought ... and where is it being fought? In the United States.

Wise words by Jose Rizal ... but he lived in the 1800s. He doesn't live today. Today, everybody is Westernized ... that doesn't neccesarilly mean Americanized.

This is my last post, this issue is dragging on, lost in a mass of boring detail and irrelavent side issues. You will always have your conspiracy theories of American policy and I will always think differently about the world ... and maybe with a bit more optimism than you.

Everyone loves discussion and by witnessing the contest of competing ideas ... maybe ... just maybe ... we can better understand what they imply.

[dirk]

Now this makes much more sense, you're only a mere boy. You're a Fil-Am, that has returned to the Philippines, bringing with you all things from the U.S., even American thought. I don't blame your optimism of America, you have been brought up by MTV. But, you are obviously confused about Americans and American policy towards the rest of the world. I agree with you that most Americans are very good people. I have many friends from Australia, the U.S., and Europe who work with our organizations, they are from Greenpeace, Amnesty Int'l, UNICEF, etc. This isn't just a Filipino problem, it's an Int'l one.

As for racism in American policy allow me to explain further. As I've noted, the ones who directly affect foreign policy are not your Chinese-American, African-American, Latino friends, the ones who make the big decisions are all Anglo-Saxon rich males (i.e. Rumsfeld, Bush, etc.) who have a foot hold in Amercan society. Going back to the mines in the philippines, if they are responsible for abuse and extensive pollution (and this has been documented thru various NGOs and the UN) shouldn't the American gov't regulate its own entities? thousands upon thousands of complaints have been submitted to the U.S. State Dept., but they have chosen not to do anything. this is foreign policy. Why is America good inside America, but treat the rest of the world as a mere place to procure natural resources? Home Depot, the american hardwear store, gets 90% of its wood from Indonesia, effectively contributing to this nation's deforestation dilemma. the U.S. has been treating the whole Gulf Region in the middle east as a big dumb gasoline station, sucking up oil, while effectively manipulating politics in the region to guarantee this 'interest'. It is American policy to suck up the rest of the world's natural resources, becuz the U.S. population is the biggest consumer nation in the world. the not caring about what happens to people, their environment, and their way of life is RACISM. This hyper consumer culture began two centuries ago in America. to satiate this unnatural hunger, they've employed slaves to produce. American policy has been justified thru 'manifest destiny', in which millions of Native Americans were annihilated, to make way for american consumption. It spread thru Hawaii, where the Dole and Del monte corporations, effectively 'acquired' what was supposed to be a sovereign nation. To the 'benevolent' assumption of the philippines. American policy dates back a few century, and it's nothing new. What has changed is the sublty of the policy, not the purpose. This is why mining abuses is American racism.

You are only 20, so hopefully you'll get a chance to understand the truth. individual racism is found everywhere, but it becomes a tragedy when racism is policy. remember the civil rights movement erupted only a generation ago, and it is still being fought. Not many filipinos care about this becuz all they want to do is go to the U.S. They have no time to critically investigate their current predicament. What they suffer from is cultural and historical amnesia. This is why filipinos are such great workers, becuz they've forgotten. You're only 20, I encourage you to remember. Our fate as a people rest on it.



"Then a new era began for the Filipinos. Little by little they lost their ancient traditions, the memory of their past. They forgot their writing, their songs, their poems, their laws, in order to learn by rote alien teachings they did not understand: a morality and an aesthetics different from those the race had inherited from its climate and ways of feeling. They went into decline, belittling themselves in their own eyes. They became ashamed of what was their own and their nation's in order to admire and praise whatever was foreign and unintelligible. Their spirit became dejected and surrendered."

Jose Rizal, Filipinas Dentro de Cien Anos (1889)

There's no use trying to open a mind that is already closed. The tragedy is that you're so young, and have so much more to learn. But like so many before, you've shed your identity for a chance at the westen identity which doesn't become you. Truly tragic. Read and learn, accept yourself for who you are, not what others want you to be.

[cebudocs_student]

dugay na kaayo ko nanganduy nga ma americana ko, pero pag human nako og basa sa lalis nilang dirk og vern murag na lain na hinuon akong pananaw sa mga americano. as in, na lain na jud. dili na ko mo adto sa u.s. kon daog-daogun lang ko nila oi !!! basta, nag lagot na ko sa mga americans ...

[mental slave]

"The philippines is among the many poverty torn nations that support America’s Iraqi liberation. Prez. Arroyo wants to help out further by offering air space and refueling stops for american war planes. i propose we go one step further. i suggest we send more young filipinas to kuwait to 'service' the young American soldiers fighting the war. this will help our American allies relieve their stress in the time of war, plus we can use this Philippines 'military aid' as an advertisement to the US to return to our islands. they use to love our islands because of the girlie bars in Subic and Clark. but sadly, the non-appreciative leftists drove our friends away. We owe the americans this 'military aid' and we need them to come back. we are only simple filipinos and we cannot run our country. we are not as smart as the Americans. so, i say let's please our American allies by sending them our best resource--the Filipina. i fondly remember when Americans called our women, 'little brown f*cking machines'. and I was their faithful 'little brown brother'. i hope the iraqis will just put down their weapons and stop resisting. the americans will liberate them. if they have to kill every single iraqi to liberate them, they will succeed. the Americans are a smart and determined people. unlike us stupid filipinos. Just like when they liberated vietnam 30 yrs ago. And our country a century ago. They killed thousands of filipinos, but it was for our liberation. For our own good. They also liberated us from the japanese. I feel such a huge debt of gratitude. when they ‘experience’ our young women again, if we send them to kuwait, they will remember our poor islands. The americans will return and save us from ourselves. I don’t care if they take our natural resources and exploit us for cheap labor. The americans have always cared for us for more than a century now. They will go to mindanao and rescue us from our worst nightmare. Then they’ll have another base to keep the muslims from ever progressing. And then we’ll be safe. With the americans in our country, we’ll be happy. And again, they will call me ‘little brown brother’. And they will call my sisters, ‘little brown f*cking machines’. The proud filipino nationalists just don’t understand that the americans don’t really mean anything bad when they call us these names, it’s just the way they say they love us filipinos. So, as soon as the Iraqis stop resisting their own liberation, I hope prez. Arroyo will invite our american friends back to our country. So, they may have fun again. And we will serve them and make them happy. Godbless America!!!" -- Vern (The Americanized Filipino Who Has Lost His Filipino Identity)

"Then a new era began for the Filipinos. Little by little they lost their ancient traditions, the memory of their past. They forgot their writing, their songs, their poems, their laws, in order to learn by rote alien teachings they did not understand: a morality and an aesthetics different from those the race had inherited from its climate and ways of feeling. They went into decline, belittling themselves in their own eyes. They became ashamed of what was their own and their nation's in order to admire and praise whatever was foreign and unintelligible. Their spirit became dejected and surrendered."


Jose Rizal, Filipinas Dentro de Cien Anos (1889)

"Filipinas Dentro de Cien Anos" translates to "Philippines in a Century". Dr. Rizal has described :arrow: Vern [and many like him] a century after his death. His description of forgetting wasn't for his generation, but for the Filipinos a century after. This is your generation Vern.

[MuzicWierdoz]

basta US sucks

[Simon]

As for racism in American policy allow me to explain further. As I've noted, the ones who directly affect foreign policy are not your Chinese-American, African-American, Latino friends, the ones who make the big decisions are all Anglo-Saxon rich males (i.e. Rumsfeld, Bush, etc.) who have a foot hold in Amercan society. Going back to the mines in the philippines, if they are responsible for abuse and extensive pollution (and this has been documented thru various NGOs and the UN) shouldn't the American gov't regulate its own entities? thousands upon thousands of complaints have been submitted to the U.S. State Dept., but they have chosen not to do anything. this is foreign policy. Why is America good inside America, but treat the rest of the world as a mere place to procure natural resources? Home Depot, the american hardwear store, gets 90% of its wood from Indonesia, effectively contributing to this nation's deforestation dilemma. the U.S. has been treating the whole Gulf Region in the middle east as a big dumb gasoline station, sucking up oil, while effectively manipulating politics in the region to guarantee this 'interest'. It is American policy to suck up the rest of the world's natural resources, becuz the U.S. population is the biggest consumer nation in the world. the not caring about what happens to people, their environment, and their way of life is RACISM. This hyper consumer culture began two centuries ago in America. to satiate this unnatural hunger, they've employed slaves to produce. American policy has been justified thru 'manifest destiny', in which millions of Native Americans were annihilated, to make way for american consumption. It spread thru Hawaii, where the Dole and Del monte corporations, effectively 'acquired' what was supposed to be a sovereign nation. To the 'benevolent' assumption of the philippines. American policy dates back a few century, and it's nothing new. What has changed is the sublty of the policy, not the purpose. This is why mining abuses is American racism.

I must admit, that's the best historical and systematic breakdown of the American problem here in the Philippines. I think most of us still suffer from colonial mentality, but are just unaware of it. It's like the "Matrix", dirk and mental slave (like Morpheus, Neo, and Trinity) are trying to show us the truth, but some people are just not ready to wake up. They'd just rather be comfortable in their little illusion of American benevolence. Me, I'm ready to wake up from this illusion. Down with America !!! Down with the System !!!