Prometheus

[anjel.d]

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Ah.... ok thanks to this thread guys. Just watched the movie recently and yep daghan loopholes sa plot. And anyone else think na unfair ang death scene ni Charlize Theron... I mean come on!

[machinecult]

star maps were made before 2,000 years ago probably back from the time that engineers and humans were once at peace....my question is, if the engineers want to anihilate their creation "the human" why us a goo, if they are far much superior capable of travelling lightyears away. they have probably something better than a blackgoo....

Most if not all the Star Maps were older than 2,000 years. They go back to ancient Mesopotamia, Sumeria, etc. some go way back before known civilization (cave paintings). Now if the benevolent Engineers/Space Jockeys drawn them, what was the purpose? There was nothing on that moon LV-223 "but death". I may have missed the idea but these might not be invitation drawings but a warning to stay away from there? Hence, Shaw says in one scene, "We were so wrong!" But why draw it in the first place and share to a young human race without any clues of its malevolence?


I believe what the crew faced on LV223 were 'baddie' Engineers who dislike mankind (for undisclosed reasons) and were bent on annihilating us. The black goo was contagious and mutates lifeforms, bio-weapons are effective in eradicating large population. Germ or chemical warfare if you will. By this method the Engineers wouldn't spend large amount of resources and use conventional warfare, or form an army to destroy mankind and risk casualties of their own.

Ah.... ok thanks to this thread guys. Just watched the movie recently and yep daghan loopholes sa plot. And anyone else think na unfair ang death scene ni Charlize Theron... I mean come on!

Vickers (Theron), obviously represents a selfish corporate drone who doesn't care about anything but her position. She doesn't even relate to her father's interests and see eye to eye on the matter. At least, that's my observation since the film's characterization is very little, I didn't care for her being rolled by a giant donut UFO. But the entire film had unnecessary deaths and plotholes and unnecessary things that were obviously included to bring more 'action' scenes.

[BertR]

Most if not all the Star Maps were older than 2,000 years. They go back to ancient Mesopotamia, Sumeria, etc. some go way back before known civilization (cave paintings). Now if the benevolent Engineers/Space Jockeys drawn them, what was the purpose? There was nothing on that moon LV-223 "but death". I may have missed the idea but these might not be invitation drawings but a warning to stay away from there? Hence, Shaw says in one scene, "We were so wrong!" But why draw it in the first place and share to a young human race without any clues of its malevolence?


I believe what the crew faced on LV223 were 'baddie' Engineers who dislike mankind (for undisclosed reasons) and were bent on annihilating us. The black goo was contagious and mutates lifeforms, bio-weapons are effective in eradicating large population. Germ or chemical warfare if you will. By this method the Engineers wouldn't spend large amount of resources and use conventional warfare, or form an army to destroy mankind and risk casualties of their own.



Vickers (Theron), obviously represents a selfish corporate drone who doesn't care about anything but her position. She doesn't even relate to her father's interests and see eye to eye on the matter. At least, that's my observation since the film's characterization is very little, I didn't care for her being rolled by a giant donut UFO. But the entire film had unnecessary deaths and plotholes and unnecessary things that were obviously included to bring more 'action' scenes.

I took the Star Maps as a chronicle of the Engineers' descent on Earth as they continually groom the human race into further evolution. I think at different periods, they send down one of their own to personally look over the development of the human race and for every visit they somehow find ways to depict the paintings as a way of saying "come visit us when you learn how to space travel."

What happened 2000 years ago is dependent on what the filmmakers wanted to impart because it was never clearly depicted. Therefore, if you take Ridley Scott's explanation about the Jesus backstory that angered the Engineers, it will still never fit to a T.

Jesus died around 33 BCE, so if they say that the annihilation of the Engineers' race occurred 2,000 years ago, that would be 93 BCE (because the year the movie takes place is 2093). Even if we give a leeway on the 60 years discrepancy, another anomaly is the fact that the Star Maps indicated 2 more visits even after Jesus' death and those were 620 CE (Mayan) and 680 CE (Hawaiian). It's either a lapse in writing (another plothole) or will be explained in subsequent sequels, if there will be sequels.

Regarding the Vickers character, I actually thought it had more depth than it seemed.

I think her character was made to represent the counterpart of David, as a sort of female alter ego but one that doesn't get the approval of his father (palagot sa kontra). She dresses like an android, she moves like an android, and she portrays an amoral, emotionless android-like character. If she is really human then she is the clear loser between her and David when it comes to her father's affection because she has feelings. Whereas David was inquisitive and curious, Vickers was no-nonsense and wanted to get the job done asap.

I agree that there are superfluous deaths and majority of the characters were clearly underdeveloped but I thought Vickers was one of the more developed ones and Theron did a good job. Besides, we never really see her getting clearly squished by the spaceship. Shaw was almost crushed too but we see that she survived.

[uncoolguy]

naa na bay download ani nga HD?

[Dorothea]

Naguol ko after ani nga movie. Why did they want to kill us? Huhuhu

[balipseyev]

If you watched Ancient Aliens sa History Channel, mao ni siya ang ilahang ultimate aim, to prove that visitors once came from the stars...

[existence]

Most if not all the Star Maps were older than 2,000 years. They go back to ancient Mesopotamia, Sumeria, etc. some go way back before known civilization (cave paintings). Now if the benevolent Engineers/Space Jockeys drawn them, what was the purpose? There was nothing on that moon LV-223 "but death". I may have missed the idea but these might not be invitation drawings but a warning to stay away from there? Hence, Shaw says in one scene, "We were so wrong!" But why draw it in the first place and share to a young human race without any clues of its malevolence?


I believe what the crew faced on LV223 were 'baddie' Engineers who dislike mankind (for undisclosed reasons) and were bent on annihilating us. The black goo was contagious and mutates lifeforms, bio-weapons are effective in eradicating large population. Germ or chemical warfare if you will. By this method the Engineers wouldn't spend large amount of resources and use conventional warfare, or form an army to destroy mankind and risk casualties of their own.



Vickers (Theron), obviously represents a selfish corporate drone who doesn't care about anything but her position. She doesn't even relate to her father's interests and see eye to eye on the matter. At least, that's my observation since the film's characterization is very little, I didn't care for her being rolled by a giant donut UFO. But the entire film had unnecessary deaths and plotholes and unnecessary things that were obviously included to bring more 'action' scenes.

Sa akong nasabtan , they hate us, because we are capable of creating another lifeform, (cyborg), in which the engineers saw this very frightening.

[machinecult]

I took the Star Maps as a chronicle of the Engineers' descent on Earth as they continually groom the human race into further evolution. I think at different periods, they send down one of their own to personally look over the development of the human race and for every visit they somehow find ways to depict the paintings as a way of saying "come visit us when you learn how to space travel."

Yes but the movie didn't seem to go that direction after all. Basically there was nothing on LV-223, except for those ship(s) formerly manned by Engineers who apparently disliked mankind and were brewing biochemicals for Earth. If that was their crux before completely leaving Earth; why leave clues that would bring us to an unhabitable moon and a very dangerous one to boot?

From Xenopedia >>LV-223 - Xenopedia

The atmosphere's main components are similar to Earth's; 71% nitrogen, and 23% oxygen. However, there is a high level of carbon monoxide, which constitutes 3% of the atmosphere. This is more than enough to be fatal to humans in a very short exposure. It also contains small amounts of argon, as detected by the spaceship

I'm musing whether we mistook those for invitation drawings and not warnings. 2,000 years is a long time maybe things happened on LV-223 that made it unhabitable but they also speculated that LV-223 was a military base engineering bioweapons.

In a simpler way of putting it: What kind of a tourist guide would send his tourists on a chemical weapons plant?

What happened 2000 years ago is dependent on what the filmmakers wanted to impart because it was never clearly depicted. Therefore, if you take Ridley Scott's explanation about the Jesus backstory that angered the Engineers, it will still never fit to a T.

Jesus died around 33 BCE, so if they say that the annihilation of the Engineers' race occurred 2,000 years ago, that would be 93 BCE (because the year the movie takes place is 2093). Even if we give a leeway on the 60 years discrepancy, another anomaly is the fact that the Star Maps indicated 2 more visits even after Jesus' death and those were 620 CE (Mayan) and 680 CE (Hawaiian). It's either a lapse in writing (another plothole) or will be explained in subsequent sequels, if there will be sequels.

The Mayan civilization was already present some 2,000 years before Christ therefore its safe to assume that those drawings were made around those times not during Christ's lifetime. For the Hawaiian I'm guessing they're based on ancient Polynesian cultures who's civilization though still obscure to this day possess archaeological findings that date the Polynesian civilization also some 2000-900 years before Christ.

I agree that there are superfluous deaths and majority of the characters were clearly underdeveloped but I thought Vickers was one of the more developed ones and Theron did a good job. Besides, we never really see her getting clearly squished by the spaceship. Shaw was almost crushed too but we see that she survived.

Some speculated she might have survive but that's the thing with this movie. It promised to answer some questions in the 1979 film but in the end it added more. Most people weren't even very curious what happened with the Engineers or "Space Jockey"; we simply came to accept the mystery that there were other unfortunate aliens fallen victim to the Xenomorph but they managed to ruin even that with this film in so many ways.

[BertR]

Yes but the movie didn't seem to go that direction after all. Basically there was nothing on LV-223, except for those ship(s) formerly manned by Engineers who apparently disliked mankind and were brewing biochemicals for Earth. If that was their crux before completely leaving Earth; why leave clues that would bring us to an unhabitable moon and a very dangerous one to boot?

From Xenopedia >>LV-223 - Xenopedia


I'm musing whether we mistook those for invitation drawings and not warnings. 2,000 years is a long time maybe things happened on LV-223 that made it unhabitable but they also speculated that LV-223 was a military base engineering bioweapons.

In a simpler way of putting it: What kind of a tourist guide would send his tourists on a chemical weapons plant?

You have to consider the very first scene. That was clearly trying to say that one of the Engineers was sacrificed to give life to humans from the Engineer's DNA. Now, even if I don't believe that they were the real creators of the humans, I think the movie was trying to say that in one way or another they were involved in the creation and the evolution of humans. Meaning to say there is ample reason why they would ensure the development of their creation (because why would you painstakingly create something just to destroy it?) unless something happened.

And this something is confirmed by the filmmaker himself to be that of Christ's crucifixion. And it'd be pointless to speculate beyond what the filmmaker himself wanted to say. Now, I still think that the star maps are invitation that were created before this something happened that triggered their changing minds.

If you're familiar with Nietzschie's ubermensch theory which is one of the bases of this film (as well as other sci-fi movies like Kubrick's magnum opus 2001: A Space Odyssey), you would know that this suggests that humans are the bridge from apes to ubermensch (superman or the Engineers in this case). Factoring this into account, the Engineers were grooming humans into evolving into the ubermensch or the Engineer race whose characteristics were SUITABLE for that planet and can travel through space.

Thus, if the humans reached the stage of becoming the ubermensch (Engineers) then they would become appropriate tourists to the planet. But if the conditions of the planet changed 2,000 years ago into something inappropriate for Engineers then that is another story.

The Mayan civilization was already present some 2,000 years before Christ therefore its safe to assume that those drawings were made around those times not during Christ's lifetime. For the Hawaiian I'm guessing they're based on ancient Polynesian cultures who's civilization though still obscure to this day possess archaeological findings that date the Polynesian civilization also some 2000-900 years before Christ.

Yes that could be true, but we are talking about what the team in the movie were able to uncover. And using carbon dating (which is the standard form of determining the ages of relics) they were able to determine the two star maps to have existed even after Christ's death. Now that doesn't say anything about the Mayan & Hawaiian civilization not existing before these star maps were made. Of course, they may already existed many years before that but the ones they discovered were created after Christ's death. If you dispute how they determine the relic ages through carbon dating, then you dispute the rest of the star maps' ages altogether.

Some speculated she might have survive but that's the thing with this movie. It promised to answer some questions in the 1979 film but in the end it added more. Most people weren't even very curious what happened with the Engineers or "Space Jockey"; we simply came to accept the mystery that there were other unfortunate aliens fallen victim to the Xenomorph but they managed to ruin even that with this film in so many ways.

Ah, but did they ever promise anything about answering the questions related to the original Alien? In fact, the filmmakers were adamant in telling the public that this should not be closely attached to the first Alien. And even if you say that they promised to answer those questions, can you not answer a question with another question?

I am not defending this movie because I think it's far from being perfect. It's not well written either, but I found the premise very interesting and I think it is overall masterfully directed. The Vickers characterization that I talk about here should be treated within the confines of Prometheus as a stand-alone movie and not be dragged into the succeeding sequels or whether she died or not. If you didn't think hers was a character that was well played subliminally by Theron to depict a three dimensional character, then you are entitled to your opinion. But the fact that people are furious of Vickers' death and this movie not answering the Alien questions are moot.

[machinecult]

Ah, but did they ever promise anything about answering the questions related to the original Alien? In fact, the filmmakers were adamant in telling the public that this should not be closely attached to the first Alien. And even if you say that they promised to answer those questions, can you not answer a question with another question?

Dead body of a Space Jockey aka the Pilot aka Engineer in Alien (1979) found on moon LV-426 "Acheron".

Engineer was killed by this little guy.

"Chestburster"

which will become this.


I've wondered what Ridley Scott's intentions are if he does not make this story canon to Alien? The impression was that film was made to tell the backstory of the "Space Jokeys" (Engineers) whos dead body was found in ALIEN events which will happen 30 years later prior to the events of Prometheus. Prometheus might be a cross-over of the Ripleyverse...I don't know...Maybe we can separate AVP movies because those were made by fans of the comics. But separating Prometheus from the Ripleyverse makes the movie seem pointless especially if it uses same movie elements such as Weyland industries, corporate androids and the obvious facehugger, designated name of locations and of course the Xenomorph in the last parts.

I am not fighting for this movie because I think it's far from being perfect. It's not well written, but I found the premise very interesting and I think it is overall masterfully directed. The Vickers characterization that I talk about here should be treated within the confines of Prometheus as a stand-alone movie and not be dragged into the succeeding sequels or whether she died or not. The fact that people are furious of Vickers' death and this movie not answering the Alien questions are confounding.

I wasn't disagreeing or agreeing with anyone and I believe its best if we share what we like and dislike about it. I myself have no problem with the premise, I find the whole ancient alien-visitation-interaction with mankind very engaging. Hence my looking forward seeing this film but became one of its disappointed fans, the so-called, "haters". The ancient alien idea is an interesting concept. My complaint is when this idea was applied on this (supposed to be) very promising film.

So far, the only decent movie I've seen with a quite similar premise was Stargate back in the 90's by incorporating Egyptian gods with extraterrestrials. Although not as 'intellectual', I believe that movie was successful because it used its mystery element more simpler and the result was a sensible film. Prometheus on the other hand overdid this theme by adding more mystery elements to it which were in the end useless - so useless that the entire film was rather pointless. If takes three films just to tell a single story I'd feel like I'm being cash-cowed. (It's like an informant spilling secrets one-by-one and asking money for each information.)

As for Vickers, she was interesting in the first hour or less but after another useless father-daughter scene (what was the point of that scene) I didn't care anymore. Actually, I stopped liking the movie after the storm scene when they got back to the ship and people were having s3x while two of their team were still LOST and in danger out there. It's like the crew never cared for each other.

I don't know if audiences thought Vickers death was unnecessary or stupid. I'm more inclined to think the way they killed her in the film was dumb and funny and that pissed people off but I lost interest in the whole film I stopped caring. It was so disappointing.