If we dont know how the universe exist, is it rational to resort to a god/religion ?

**bluedes** · 12-05-2009, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by Traditz

Hello sir.

Hope you don't mind if muapil ko sa inyo discussion.

Are you saying nga relative ra jud tanan moral values between societies and individuals?

yeah.. between societies and individuals, relative ra jud ang morality..

for some people to claim na absolute ang morality, wala na na sila ni-care or concerned sa other person, they are just concerned about their own welfare.. which is very selfish na..

for example, generally, i am against abortion, but not in an absolute case.. before i advice against abortion, i have to listen to the circumstances and the situation unique to the individual, kay di man ta kahibalo sa truth if we just see everything at the surface as the same without looking deeper..

as for stealing and killing, these are generally frowned upon by society, but that's because time and time again has shown that in most cases, stealing and killing is not good.. but not all cases, because sometimes, relative man pud ang term na stealing.. for you, in may look like stealing, but to another, he is just doing what he thought was necessary at that time..

and these rules did not come from God or the Bible.. try talking to non-christian group like japanese or chinese, do you think they learned that stealing is not generally good from the Bible? that's why morality is born out of society, and not some absolute entity or some holy book.. part na sa evolution sa society that they will have moral legislation to keep the society in order..

**Pein** · 12-05-2009, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by bluedes

yeah.. between societies and individuals, relative ra jud ang morality..

for some people to claim na absolute ang morality, wala na na sila ni-care or concerned sa other person, they are just concerned about their own welfare.. which is very selfish na..

for example, generally, i am against abortion, but not in an absolute case.. before i advice against abortion, i have to listen to the circumstances and the situation unique to the individual, kay di man ta kahibalo sa truth if we just see everything at the surface as the same without looking deeper..

as for stealing and killing, these are generally frowned upon by society, but that's because time and time again has shown that in most cases, stealing and killing is not good.. but not all cases, because sometimes, relative man pud ang term na stealing.. for you, in may look like stealing, but to another, he is just doing what he thought was necessary at that time..

and these rules did not come from God or the Bible.. try talking to non-christian group like japanese or chinese, do you think they learned that stealing is not generally good from the Bible? that's why morality is born out of society, and not some absolute entity or some holy book.. part na sa evolution sa society that they will have moral legislation to keep the society in order..

maong tanang tawo nakahibaw kung unsay maayo ug dautan kay instinct na sa tawo ang pagkamaayo...bisan pag wala ka nakabalita ug Bibliya kahibaw gihapon ka kung unsay maayo ug dautan kay natural na sa tawo ang pagkamaayo.

**bluedes** · 12-05-2009, 06:23 AM

Originally Posted by Pein

maong tanang tawo nakahibaw kung unsay maayo ug dautan kay instinct na sa tawo ang pagkamaayo...bisan pag wala ka nakabalita ug Bibliya kahibaw gihapon ka kung unsay maayo ug dautan kay natural na sa tawo ang pagkamaayo.

i'm glad you agree..
frankly, i'm a bit disappointed.. (pero good disappointment)

abi nko gud na muangkon ka na ang morality gikan sa bible.. or religion.. pero sayop akong abi..

**xeoxander01** · 12-05-2009, 07:29 AM

Originally Posted by bluedes

yeah.. between societies and individuals, relative ra jud ang morality..

for some people to claim na absolute ang morality, wala na na sila ni-care or concerned sa other person, they are just concerned about their own welfare.. which is very selfish na..

for example, generally, i am against abortion, but not in an absolute case.. before i advice against abortion, i have to listen to the circumstances and the situation unique to the individual, kay di man ta kahibalo sa truth if we just see everything at the surface as the same without looking deeper..

as for stealing and killing, these are generally frowned upon by society, but that's because time and time again has shown that in most cases, stealing and killing is not good.. but not all cases, because sometimes, relative man pud ang term na stealing.. for you, in may look like stealing, but to another, he is just doing what he thought was necessary at that time..

and these rules did not come from God or the Bible.. try talking to non-christian group like japanese or chinese, do you think they learned that stealing is not generally good from the Bible? that's why morality is born out of society, and not some absolute entity or some holy book.. part na sa evolution sa society that they will have moral legislation to keep the society in order..

apil2x ko ha... so your letting your society dictate whats moral and whats not??.. sa ato pah jam-jam rah diay ni imo??..

**chad_tukes** · 12-05-2009, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by xeoxander01

apil2x ko ha... so your letting your society dictate whats moral and whats not??.. sa ato pah jam-jam rah diay ni imo??..

basically, yes that is correct. morality is dictated by society. read more about Moral Zeitgeist and you'll know what i'm talking about.

**bluedes** · 12-05-2009, 09:33 AM

Originally Posted by xeoxander01

apil2x ko ha... so your letting your society dictate whats moral and whats not??.. sa ato pah jam-jam rah diay ni imo??..

morality in a society is a two-way street..

pero if you live in a dictatorial society, aww ikaw, adto live in a dictatorial society kaw..

i live in a democratic and libertarian society..

**Hellblazer 2.1** · 12-05-2009, 12:36 PM

for me, if i don't know how the universe began or came into existence, i will continually seek for the Truth and not just blame it on an invisible man living in the sky.

**cromagnon** · 12-08-2009, 09:50 AM

^ "to think is to differ "

morality in a society is a two-way street..

pero if you live in a dictatorial society, aww ikaw, adto live in a dictatorial society kaw..

i live in a democratic and libertarian society..

di ba ang kamikazee - die in honor man to cla , prtly sa religion ang cause ato / imperial.