All about Roman Catholicism here.

[mosimos]

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Wheres the money in there? I thought about cash. Wow fire away weedmeister.

[weedmeister]

why thank you! :mrgreen: regarding the money, then!


well, first and foremost... the Church is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ, right? right!

and that the pope is supposed to be the successor of JC on earth, right so far...? okay... good.

And the church is supposed to uphold ALL of JC's teachings.

That means the pope, no... ESPECIALLY the pope, right? yah, because he is "JC on earth", right? right.

now, what were those things that JC said again... hmmm, oh yeah... okay, about money:

"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

and

"There was a rich man who dressed in purple garments and fine linen and dined sumptuously each day.
And lying at his door was a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores,
who would gladly have eaten his fill of the scraps that fell from the rich man's table. Dogs even used to come and lick his sores.
When the poor man died, he was carried away by angels to the bosom of Abraham. The rich man also died and was buried,
and from the netherworld, where he was in torment, he raised his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side."

and

No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. (one master being wealth, the other, JC)

and many more like it in the bible... i'm sure you are familiar with them, right? okay...


so, if we said that JC is the God of the Vatican, and the above are his teachings, and the Vatican has to follow JC, since the pope is JC on earth, ergo THE VATICAN MUST GIVE ALL ITS RICHES TO THE POOR.

why don't they do that then? JC said in Luke 12:33 "Sell that which you have, and give gifts to the needy." If Jesus went up to the Vatican today and said to the pope "Give all your billions in gold, real estate, art, etc. to the needy" what do you think would happen? JC WOULD BE CRUCIFIED AGAIN! why, because the pope works for money, and the love of money is evil, ergo THE POPE IS EVIL.

Have you heard about Albino Luciani, also known as Pope Paul I. He was put on the papal seat because he was one to never really offend anyone, but once he sat there, he wanted to revolutionize the church, i.e. approve of contraception, give more to the poor, remove the corrupt cardinals, he addressed himself as "I" instead of the usual papal "WE" because he knew he was just a man who worked for JC. In effect, he wanted to revamp the whole vatican and make it the way JC wanted it.

What happened to him? HE LASTED 33 DAYS AND WAS KILLED. until this day the vatican has different excuses for what happened, but never a clear resolution.. is that the Church of God? are those the teachings of GOD? or are they the work of the devil?

[at8n1981]

WOW...very explicitly explained....now mosimos it's ur turn..pls don't copy & paste from some excerpts....hehehee..

[whiteoleander]

@at8n1981Â* is that what you call a very explicit explanation ?Â* he even states that the pope isÂ* "JC on earth".Â* whoever said that ?!Â*

@weedmeister , i am not into these kind of arguments and i had no plansÂ* to butt in , but i can't let this one pass ... this is way too funnyÂ*

i can't wait to read more of you .

i can't imagine how you would analyze the death of the late Mother Teresa or the late Pope John Paul IIÂ* perhaps ? any theory you can share ?Â*

[shoeless_rebel]

mother teresa and the late Pope John paul II died of obvious reasons...

Pope Paul I death was a lil suspicious... m not saying that the conspiracy theory is true... it's too movie-ish to be the truth.

i know truth is stranger than fiction so who knows ryt?

[mosimos]

why thank you!Â* :mrgreen: regarding the money, then!Â*


well, first and foremost... the Church is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ, right? right!

and that the pope is supposed to be the successor of JC on earth, right so far...? okay... good.

And the church is supposed to uphold ALL of JC's teachings.

That means the pope, no... ESPECIALLY the pope, right? yah, because he is "JC on earth", right? right.

now, what were those things that JC said again... hmmm, oh yeah... okay, about money:

"Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moth and rust do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.

and

"There was a rich man who dressed in purple garments and fine linen and dined sumptuously each day.
And lying at his door was a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores,
who would gladly have eaten his fill of the scraps that fell from the rich man's table. Dogs even used to come and lick his sores.
When the poor man died, he was carried away by angels to the bosom of Abraham. The rich man also died and was buried,
and from the netherworld, where he was in torment, he raised his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side."

and

No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. (one master being wealth, the other, JC)

and many more like it in the bible... i'm sure you are familiar with them, right? okay...


so, if we said that JC is the God of the Vatican, and the above are his teachings, and the Vatican has to follow JC, since the pope is JC on earth, ergo THE VATICAN MUST GIVE ALL ITS RICHES TO THE POOR.

why don't they do that then? JC said in Luke 12:33 "Sell that which you have, and give gifts to the needy." If Jesus went up to the Vatican today and said to the pope "Give all your billions in gold, real estate, art, etc. to the needy" what do you think would happen? JC WOULD BE CRUCIFIED AGAIN! why, because the pope works for money, and the love of money is evil, ergo THE POPE IS EVIL.

Have you heard about Albino Luciani, also known as Pope Paul I. He was put on the papal seat because he was one to never really offend anyone, but once he sat there, he wanted to revolutionize the church, i.e. approve of contraception, give more to the poor, remove the corrupt cardinals, he addressed himself as "I" instead of the usual papal "WE" because he knew he was just a man who worked for JC. In effect, he wanted to revamp the whole vatican and make it the way JC wanted it.

What happened to him? HE LASTED 33 DAYS AND WAS KILLED. until this day the vatican has different excuses for what happened, but never a clear resolution.. is that the Church of God? are those the teachings of GOD? or are they the work of the devil?

I am not surprised. Weidmeister is master of conspiracy theories. He cashes on it. Where do you read that Pope John Paul I approved contraception? This is another chismis circulating by conspiracy theorists.

Pope is all for money? Think again. This another lie and misconception spread by the enemies of the Church.

The Church has money. Right. The Church has businesses. Right. What do you expect to the Church? Rely on charities? from the Sunday collections. The Church also has to generate income so as not to become another parasite of society. It has to sustain itself as it is striving to help the poor.

Give money to the poor. Yes. We have so many Catholic charities helping the poor and the needy. YOu just dont know them becuae you refuse to know or recognize them to further your dark agenda.

[weedmeister]

@at8n1981Â*Â* Â* is that what you call a very explicit explanation ?Â*Â* he even states that the pope isÂ* "JC on earth".Â* whoever said that ?!Â*

@weedmeister , i am not into these kind of arguments and i had no plansÂ* to butt in , but i can't let this one pass ... this is way too funnyÂ*

i can't wait to read more of you .

i can't imagine how you would analyze the death of the late Mother Teresa or the late Pope John Paul IIÂ* perhaps ? any theory you can share ?Â*

hahaha, my friend, i suggest you read up first before you speak out again...Â* :mrgreen:

The catholic church teaches that the pope is Jesus on earth. I was taught that in ateneo for 9 years. i guess the jesuits were just making that up... what would the jesuits know eh...? oh my, let me see... here's something:

The Pope (from Greek: pappas, father; from Latin: papa, Papa, father1) is the head of the Catholic Church. He is the Successor of St. Peter as Bishop of Rome. The office of the Pope is called the Papacy; his ecclesiastical jurisdiction is called the Holy See (Sancta Sedes in Latin) or Apostolic See (this latter, on the basis that both St. Peter and St. Paul were martyred at Rome). Early bishops occupying the See of Rome were designated Vicar of Peter (representative of St. Peter); for later popes the more authoritative Vicar of Christ was substituted; this designation was first used by the Roman Synod of AD 495 to refer to Pope Gelasius I, an advocate of papal supremacy among the patriarchs. Many believe Vicar of Christ is more appropriate to the Pope, as Catholics believe he takes the place of Jesus as the visible head of the Church.


Whoa, you don't say....!Â* tsk, tsk, tsk... it pays to think before you speak, whiteoleander...

as for the death of pope paul I... well, maybe you are not informed enough of the tendency of the Vatican to kill its own when the pope doesn't think the way they want him to... what's that you say... it's unfounded? oh, okay, i guess these guys can forget about it then:

John VIII (872-882): Poisoned and clubbed to death
Adrian III, St. (884-885): Rumored poisoned
Stephen VI (896-897): Strangled
Leo V (903): Murdered
John X (914-92: Suffocated under a pillow
Stephen VII (VIII) (928-931): Possibly murdered
Stephen VIII (IX) (939-942): Mutilated and died from injuries
John XII (955-964): Suffered a stroke while with a mistress or murdered by an outraged husbandÂ*
Benedict VI (973-974): Strangled by a priest
John XIV (983-984): Starved to death or poisoned
Gregory V (996-999): Rumored poisoned, probably malaria
Sergius IV (1009-1012): Possibly murdered
Clement II (1046-1047): Rumored poisoned
Damasus II (104: Rumored murdered

I know what you're gonna say, most of these are rumors... do you know why? because the Vatican keeps it secret. a pope can never have an autopsy without the consent of the vatican... why? you tell me... MAYBE THEY'RE HIDING SOMETHING.Â*

so, whiteoleander, anymore unfounded wiseass remarks?Â* :mrgreen:

[weedmeister]

I am not surprised.Â* Weidmeister is master of conspiracy theories. He cashes on it. Where do you read that Pope John Paul I approved contraception?Â* This is another chismis circulating by conspiracy theorists.

Pope is all for money? Think again. This another lie and misconception spread by the enemies of the Church.Â*

The Church has money.Â* Right.Â* The Church has businesses.Â* Right. What do you expect to the Church?Â* Rely on charities? from the Sunday collections.Â* The Church also has to generate income so as not to become another parasite of society.Â* Â*It has to sustain itself as it is striving to help the poor.Â*

Give money to the poor.Â* Yes.Â* We have so many Catholic charities helping the poor and the needy.Â* YOu just dont know them becuae you refuse to know or recognize them to further your dark agenda.Â*

you're right brother mosimos, Pope Paul I NEVER got to approve contraception... why? because he was killed. I guess WIKIPEDIA just made this up:

"He (POPE PAUL I) raised considerable worry within the Vatican when he met with representatives of the United Nations to discuss the issue of overpopulation in the Third World, an issue which was particularly controversial because of the Catholic Church's stance against artificial birth control."

I guess he just wanted to meet with the UN to say "WAZZZZAAAAP?" right? yah, whatever... :mrgreen: damn WIKIPEDIA, such an enemy of the CHURCH!


You said: The Church also has to generate income so as not to become another parasite of society

hahahahaha! yah, can you define parasite brother? a parasite is an organism that feeds of another without giving much in return... now, how many percent of the Vatican's wealth do you think they give to the poor? do you see them giving away their gold to their starving parishioners? do you see them giving their vast lands to their homeless beleivers? do you see them selling their art to save the sick?

So lets say they give 10 percent of their assets to the poor (which they will never do), do you think that's enough? is that in line with Jesus' teachings of "Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth" and "No man can serve two masters"? Come on, wake up mosimos. The church exists to amass wealth and power, not to feed the poor, nor to save your soul, because THEY CANNOT EVEN SAVE THEIRS. The church's assets can sustain major countries, so don't think that they are just "surviving" or "getting by".... they are DAMN RICH brother, and you'd better beleive it.

You know who the real christians are? its not the pope, not the cardinals, not the monsignors who are all plump and riding their mercedes, and eating at Tinderbox, and attending grand openings and occassions... it's just not them. the real christians are those priests who go to the mangyans and aetas and teach them about the bible. the real christians are those you find working in the slum areas around the country, trying to better the standard of living, or working hand in hand with the farmers to find new ways to earn money and keep them alive. those are the real christians that CHRIST is looking forward to meeting when the time comes.


So please, don't give me this cr*p about the church not wanting money, and not killing its own. It's the biggest and wealthiest corporation in the world. People would kill for that, they're only human, even if they call themselves holy or they wear fancy robes... deep down they commit the same sins as us, even more so, as they have vowed to be celibate and to shun the trappings of a material life.

[mosimos]

Pope John Paul I did not approve contraception because he died. Is this all you got? Just because he discussed with the United Nations about the issue of overpopulation does not mean healready approved the use of contraception among the faithful.

"do you see them giving away their gold to their starving parishioners? do you see them giving their vast lands to their homeless beleivers? do you see them selling their art to save the sick?"

Why is the Church that rich in gold? Do they have vast tracts of land for farming like hundreds of hectares? Selling the art to save the sick? why does it have to. One could muster funds without selling those priceless work of art. Do you mean to say you sell Michaelangelos' frescoes in the Sistine Chapel? The Church had been helping the sick since time immemorial. BTW, the obligation to care for the sick is not only a responsibility of the church. Its the responsibility of everyone. How about you? What are you doing to help the sick? Unless you consider yourself exempted from that duty.

"The church exists to amass wealth and power, not to feed the poor, nor to save your soul, because THEY CANNOT EVEN SAVE THEIRS. The church's assets can sustain major countries, so don't think that they are just "surviving" or "getting by".... they are DAMN RICH brother, and you'd better beleive it."

The Church exists because Jesus Christ created it. It is established by God as a covenant to His people on eternal salvation. It existrs for spiritual purpose not worldly ones like amassing wealth and power. No one is assured of salvation. We have to work it out as people of God united in prayer for our deliverance from eternal damnation.

How I wish what you're saying about the wealth of the Church is true so that we could complete the grills and the roof of our chapel.

You know who the real christians are? its not the pope, not the cardinals, not the monsignors who are all plump and riding their mercedes, and eating at Tinderbox, and attending grand openings and occassions... it's just not them. the real christians are those priests who go to the mangyans and aetas and teach them about the bible. the real christians are those you find working in the slum areas around the country,


Bear in mind, that the bishops first and foremost are priest before they become bishops. They are also priest who work with the mangyans and aetas and those in the slums. Yet because of their exemplary work and their devotion to the Church and his people, they are elevated to as bishops, cardinals and then as Popes.

If I follow your logic, it would be like saying while he was a priest he was a man for God. Now because of his dedication he is elevated to a bishop then it is when the time nga wala na hinoon siya sa Ginoo. DOESNT MAKE SENSE, ISNT IT?

John VIII (872-882): Poisoned and clubbed to death
Adrian III, St. (884-885): Rumored poisoned
Stephen VI (896-897): Strangled
Leo V (903): Murdered
John X (914-92: Suffocated under a pillow
Stephen VII (VIII) (928-931): Possibly murdered
Stephen VIII (IX) (939-942): Mutilated and died from injuries
John XII (955-964): Suffered a stroke while with a mistress or murdered by an outraged husband
Benedict VI (973-974): Strangled by a priest
John XIV (983-984): Starved to death or poisoned
Gregory V (996-999): Rumored poisoned, probably malaria
Sergius IV (1009-1012): Possibly murdered
Clement II (1046-1047): Rumored poisoned
Damasus II (104: Rumored murdered

I know what you're gonna say, most of these are rumors... do you know why? because the Vatican keeps it secret. a pope can never have an autopsy without the consent of the vatican... why? you tell me... MAYBE THEY'RE HIDING SOMETHING.

There you are. wala pa gni jko mo respond defensive ka na. Those Popes died. Its only up to there that we know. Let us not speculate whats behind their death if we dont have any basis. This is another chismis and black prop.

[bcasabee]

If we stop listening from Vatican......then which church do you suggest we turn to? Any suggestion?

uh, dunno if this has come up here already, but you guys have to open your eyes, the VATICAN is a money and power making business... there are good and bad priests, but they all serve the VATICAN corporation.


"The Vatican's treasure of solid gold has been estimated by the United Nations World Magazine to amount to several billion dollars. A large bulk of this is stored in gold ingots with the U.S. Federal Reserve Bank, while banks in England and Switzerland hold the rest. But this is just a small portion of the wealth of the Vatican, which in the U.S. alone, is greater than that of the five wealthiest giant corporations of the country. When to that is added all the real estate, property, stocks and shares abroad, then the staggering accumulation of the wealth of the Catholic church becomes so formidable as to defy any rational assessment.

"The Catholic church is the biggest financial power, wealth accumulator and property owner in existence. She is a greater possessor of material riches than any other single institution, corporation, bank, giant trust, government or state of the whole globe. The pope, as the visible ruler of this immense amassment of wealth, is consequently the richest individual of the twentieth century. No one can realistically assess how much he is worth in terms of billions of dollars."

It's all JUST MERGERS & ACQUISITIONS....


so, of course they would get pissed off by the Da Vinci Code... it shows a little bit of what the truth is, and the VATICAN is saying "SHUT UP!" :mrgreen: