RELIGION....(part 2)

[Sovabon]

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Definitely no one! Only God knows everyone's fate as He is our sole Saviour.

[mannyamador]

I don't believe in "easy believism", but I also don't believe in "salvation by works" which is very much what is implied in the teachings of the RCC although they profess salvation by "faith and works" and despite that verse from first John, aren't even assured of that salvation.

That is a contradiction. If one is absolutely assured of salvation, then no works are needed, and no sin can undo one's salvation. But then you say works are necessary. Which means that salvation is not assured since one can refuse to do the works needed. The CONTRADICTION is quite clear.

The bottom line: faith alone does not save, and is no assurance of salvation. You must LIVE out your faith. Refusal to do so, leads to condemnation. Salvation is NOT assured because we can commit sin. That is CLEAR in the Bible.

[mannyamador]

For by grace you have been saved through FAITH and not by your works lest anyone should boast. For we are HIS workmanship...

IF we can be saved by deeds...then there's no point in having GOD as the only WAY, TRUTH, and LIFE.

This interpetation is contradicted by the verses in James cited earlier. This point has already been discredited.

[Cardinal Bunal]

Nope, we can be assured (1 Jn 5: 13 ) it's also in first John that the one who persists in sin is NOT born of God...

but whether we can either choose to live in sin or choose to live in righteousness. Does that mean NOT a single sin will ever be commited as long as we are still living? No, because if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves...

But it is NOT good works that offset sin, we are still sanctified by faith and belief in His name (Acts 10: 43, Acts 26: 18 )

It is CERTAIN: there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus1 but what is uncertain is whether one chooses to follow His commandments completely, or to look around and backslip 2

This interpetation is contradicted by the verses in James cited earlier. This point has already been discredited.

In other words, you are saying, James contradicts Paul...... He is merely emphasizing what Paul said we are saved to do. We are God's workmanship. 3

1. Rom 8: 1
2. Luke 9: 62
3. Eph. 2: 9 - 10, James 2: 18

[mitch_a888]

@ MITCH_888 .... di na ATHEIST si LAWRENCE but a wannabe COMMUNIST living in LOS ANGELES . FUNNY ...

ow, okies..no wonder..

[mannyamador]

It is CERTAIN: there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus1 but what is uncertain is whether one chooses to follow His commandments completely, or to look around and backslip

And then what? If salvation is certain, then a "saved" person can massacre a few hundred people and stll remain saved? You're dreaming!

That kind of absolutist thinking is exactly the same kind of garbage Martin Luther was spouting when he said that we should "sin well", and that even if he should fornicate a hunded trimes a day he was still sure of his salvation. Well, he's probably got more than enough time now in hell to realize how wrong he was.

The bottom line: having "faith" does NOT mean your salvation is certain. It requires works, repentance, and a real resolution to avoid sin.

In other words, you are saying, James contradicts Paul...... He is merely emphasizing what Paul said we are saved to do. We are God's workmanship.

YOUR PERSONAL (and wrong) INTERPRETATION of Paul is what contradicts James.

[Cardinal Bunal]

And then what? If salvation is certain, then a "saved" person can massacre a few hundred people and stll remain saved? You're dreaming!

Well, if he did it with harmful intent KNOWING that God commands that we shouldn't repay wrong for wrong (Rom. 12: 18, 21, 1 Thes. 5: 15 ) then his salvation sure as hell could be undone...

A "saved" person is in Christ Jesus, anyone who doesn't walk in godliness is NOT saved... even those who don't know the Gospel but have God's commands written in their hearts have the potential to be rewarded for that salvation (Rom 2: 10 - 12 ) BUT it is Christ Jesus who is the assurance of that salvation. Again, Rom 8: 1

[zengatsu]

ngano awayan or debatehan man tawon ni ang religion uy?? respito nalang unta ta sa religion sa uban bisag dili ta pareha ug tinuohan

[dacs]

Oopppssss...

Wrong forum.

... (wondering) ...

Yeah, wrong forum.

[Cardinal Bunal]

Oopppssss...

Wrong forum.

... (wondering) ...

Yeah, wrong forum.

Sir,

naa ba ka'y anak ga eskwela og BS Psychology sa Main nonetheless connected man ka sa USC diba? ECE department... I wonder if related tong classmate nako nimo ... wa nako gi trippingan ha! waheheheehhe