National Language: Tagalog Or Bisaya

[bisan]

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Niether Tagalog or Bisaya should be the national language for the simple reason that there really is not 'nation' of the Philippines. There is a republic. The common cultural cultural connection between the Tagalogs, Cebuanos, Hiligaynons, Ilocanos, Bikolanos etc is Spanish. Spanish and English should be used for communication between the nations. Spanish and English are outside laguages that Filipinos will likely be impartial too. Spanish culture permeates the Philippines. Filipino culture is overwhelmingly more Spanish than anything else. The culture cannot really be called Asian other than for the fact that it's located in Southeast Asia.

Tagalog: I'd be wary of Philippine government censuses that say Tagalog has more native speakers than Cebuano. I think the government is manipulating the numbers to make it appear as tho Tagalog is the leader in terms of numbers. One in three Manileños speaks another Filipino language. It could be that they count all those people in Manila as native speakers of Tagalog. Censuses seem to be fautly anyway because for Cebuano I've anything from 12,000,000 to 21 million native speakers. Why? How could there be such a variation of 9 million native speakers. And these were not censuses taken 50 years ago.

Bisaya: It's commonly understood that when someone says that they speak "Bisaya" that they mean the language spoken in Cebu, Negros, Leyte, Bohol, Mindanao. Although those who speak Hiligaynon, Waray, Aklanon, Kinaray-a etc are equally Visayan, Cebuano is spoken in more regions in the Visayas and Mindanao. Also, many native speakers of Cebuano don't identify as Cebuano, that is, they don't think of themselves as people from Cebu but more they think of themselves as Mindanao Visayans, Bol-anons, Leyteños etc. Therefore the Cebuano language is often refered to as Bisaya.


Glenn said:

"I guess it doesn't take a long debate to that....coz tagalog has been in our culture since the time that we are called filipinos.............now if we are going to change the cultural data, ano yan charter change?.............it has been in our history to used tagalog as our national language, and it is correct where ever you go if your not familiar with the dialect that they are using you can communicate them thru tagalog...........especially in Mindanao.........and if we are to used english as our national language, actually english has different viariations too like the english french or the english british and the american english, mura pud na og sa ato mga bisaya kay sa Davao ang bisaya malanguy paman ang diri sa Cebu pirti jud kalalum. Sama sa bas nga dapat balas ang pagka pronounced sa Davao ang bas kay bus nga sakyanan ang pagsabot ana, karsones sa Davao pantalon na siya, kutaw nga pirti ka lalum sa Davao timpla na siya...........so we cannot run to what we called unity interms of dialouge..................even in cebuano dialouge............."

Cebuano has been in our culture since we werwe first called filipinos too. In fact Cebuano is a much older language than Tagalog. Anyway what kind of argument is that? Also it's not correct as you put it to address someone in a Cebuano speaking region in Tagalog. You might have the ability to do it and people might be happy to speak with you in Tagalog but it's still not 'correct'. This is to imply that Tagalog is superior to Cebuano. The only reason Tagalog is the National Language is because the Spaniards moved the capital to Manila. I'm insulted as a Cebuano that I'm expected to know Tagalog but Tagalogs make no effort to learn Cebuano and make fun of our accent. (Has anyone seen the movie Minsan Pa? Do the Tagalogs not have an weird accent when they speak Cebuano?) The fact that it's 'in our history' doesn't make it right either. Slavery is in the history of the United States. Is that correct?

[pnoize]

aaah...another bisaya vs. tagalog thread.

@bisan: if you take a closer look, Tagalogs who do business in Cebu actually make an effort to learn the language. in your statement you said that Tagalogs make fun of the bisaya accent and then contradict yourself by saying that Tagalogs sound funny when they try to speak in Cebuano. Also, one of the reasons that some Tagalogs make no effort is because their Cebuano colleagues speak to them in Tagalog.

Frankly speaking, these Cebuano vs. Tagalog, Tagalog vs. Cebuano threads is getting to be tiresome. These are obvious cases of racism and bigotry, do you fight racism and bigotry by being a bigot yourselves? or do you fight it with knowledge and enlightenment by not stepping down to that level?

What people should do is prove to themselves that they are better than these bigots. Move on, let history be history, learn from it and not live it.

[Wind Shear]

And yeah. I rather have Cebuano language. In my opinion, there is no such thing as national language in Philippines (if we are talking of cultural homogenity).

[bisan]

I didn't contradict myself. When I say that Tagalogs who make an effort to speak Cebuano sound weird (I didn't say funny), it's not a mockery of them. It's a statement about the existence of an accent. By weird I meant more like not natural as opposed to silly. People talk with accents, so what? I like people who talk with accents. I was addressing the Tagalogs who make fun of our accent as though they would be able to speak perfect Cebuano if they tried. But save that, whether or not they could speak perfect Cebuano doesn't mean they should mock those who don't speak perfect Tagalog. Also, I was addressing the unfairness that Tagalogs are not required to learn any-non Tagalog language but non-Tagalogs are. That's wonderful that Tagalogs who live in Cebu learn Cebuano but why are Cebuanos who live in Cebuano-speaking regions of the Philippines expected to know Tagalog? Why shouldn't those in Manila and surrounding regions be expected to learn Cebuano? That is imbalanced.

Also pnoize, your reply doesn't necessarily say that I'm a bigot but I have the feeling that you think that I am because you misunderstood my post. I'm not a bigot. Again, I don't think that Cebuano is a superior language. I'm reacting to the bigotry of those who support Tagalog as the national language. Never did I say that Cebuano is a better language or that Cebuanos are better people. Cebu doesn't have a Tagalog heritage why should we be expected learn it? Why is singing the national anthem in Cebuano outlawed when it was a Spanish anthem to begin with? You say that these threads are becoming tiresome (by the way I'm not starting this thread I'm replying to a thread started a long time ago) but what are we supposed to do sit here and say nothing about this issue? Also, if you read what I said, I said that I don't think that Cebuano or Tagalog should be the national language and that Spanish and English should be used as communcating languages of the Philippines because we have a collective Spanish and American heritage. Also, Spanish and English are highly reconized languages that would attract more people to the Philippines. If anything the government should recognize all languages as official languages of each region and should support the growth and cultivation of our respective languages as opposed to pushing one language chosen by people who are natives to that language. Why is Cebuano not recognized officially? Is it only like a slang language of the streets? Really pnoize.

[pnoize]

I didn't contradict myself. When I say that Tagalogs who make an effort to speak Cebuano sound weird (I didn't say funny), it's not a mockery of them. It's a statement about the existence of an accent. By weird I meant more like not natural as opposed to silly. People talk with accents, so what? I like people who talk with accents. I was addressing the Tagalogs who make fun of our accent as though they would be able to speak perfect Cebuano if they tried. But save that, whether or not they could speak perfect Cebuano doesn't mean they should mock those who don't speak perfect Tagalog. Also, I was addressing the unfairness that Tagalogs are not required to learn any-non Tagalog language but non-Tagalogs are. That's wonderful that Tagalogs who live in Cebu learn Cebuano but why are Cebuanos who live in Cebuano-speaking regions of the Philippines expected to know Tagalog? Why shouldn't those in Manila and surrounding regions be expected to learn Cebuano? That is imbalanced.

Also pnoize, your reply doesn't necessarily say that I'm a bigot but I have the feeling that you think that I am because you misunderstood my post. I'm not a bigot. Again, I don't think that Cebuano is a superior language. I'm reacting to the bigotry of those who support Tagalog as the national language. Never did I say that Cebuano is a better language or that Cebuanos are better people. Cebu doesn't have a Tagalog heritage why should we be expected learn it? Why is singing the national anthem in Cebuano outlawed when it was a Spanish anthem to begin with? You say that these threads are becoming tiresome (by the way I'm not starting this thread I'm replying to a thread started a long time ago) but what are we supposed to do sit here and say nothing about this issue? Also, if you read what I said, I said that I don't think that Cebuano or Tagalog should be the national language and that Spanish and English should be used as communcating languages of the Philippines because we have a collective Spanish and American heritage. Also, Spanish and English are highly reconized languages that would attract more people to the Philippines. If anything the government should recognize all languages as official languages of each region and should support the growth and cultivation of our respective languages as opposed to pushing one language chosen by people who are natives to that language. Why is Cebuano not recognized officially? Is it only like a slang language of the streets? Really pnoize.

when i posted about bigotry, i wasn't referring to you or your post. if you read a few posts above yours, some members have resorted to name-calling. don't be too defensive.

[FK]

being proud of our cebuano culture is good... but to the point that you look down on others just because of their language is not...

i thought most people here want unity among Filipinos? then why many are talking on how great CEBUANO is and how TAGALOG sucks? Is this the way to Unity?

[aying d great]

your'e right mr. FK.. that's why our country is divided because of this racial dispute. why not follow the law and make tagalog our own dialect and the fact english is also our secondary dialouge why speak english if you sucks tagalog....!!

[diem]

i believe this a relevant issue... it is said the soul of a nation is its language...

personally, even as a Cebuano , i vote for the dialect EVERYONE ON EVERY ISLAND understands... that's the essence of communication di ba? Makasabot ang lahat.

And i just pray for the day we can just be Filipinos speaking Filipino and just enjoy the diversity of dialects rather than use these as cause for division... bisaya, tagalog, it shouldn't matter, English? who cares...

tayo ay pilipino.. maging pilipino tayo...

[Wind Shear]

Very basic question: What's the difference between language and dialect? Get your English dictionary and I hope you will enlighten.

[diem]

@windshear, let me put this simply.. IN THE GENERAL SENSE, a language is used by a larger number of people than that of a dialect which is not widespread and often restricted to a small communal region or people minority.Â*

For example, most natives of this country speak and understand Filipino, therefore it is considered the language of this country.Â* But the Ifugaos of the north have their own language, their dialect, which only they and those who have learned it could understand and these people are few compared to the major population.