Gays and Lesbians in Churches

[FK]

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@nonon:

bai pareho sa ako example gihatag... you can't be a good leader if you are not practicing what you are preaching.

[dacs]

the history of the church speaks for itself

Would you kindly specify? Please be as specific as you can.

[Nonon]

@FK:

i think it's not the same....

ang policeman tangtangon siya co'z naa na siya sa serbisyo and he committed something unlawful..."while he's in the service"

but....the issue here is "if we will allow gays and lesbians to church leaders"....and it is "before they even started to lead"....

i think what you are asserting here is the "moral issue" not the "leadership issue"....

[Nonon]

the history of the church speaks for itself

Would you kindly specify? Please be as specific as you can.

haven't you read your "history books"

[dacs]

haven't you read your "history books"

I could easily ask the same thing : Haven't you read the history book? Often, I met people who have read a history. Let's cut the crap and go to the details. Cite specific example(s); then, I'll get back to you.

[Nonon]

how about this:

this happened in PERU....

Until 1588, natives were barred from being ordained or joining a monastic order. This led to great racial inequality within the church hierarchy.

Throughout the 1700s, church officials usually assigned top posts to Spanish-born whites. Secondary positions went to Creoles [whites born in the New World]. Mestizo [mixed European and Indian ancestry] priests usually received difficult parishes. At the bottom of the racial ladder stood Indian priests; though Indians made up more than 44 percent of the population, they were appointed to low prestige parishes.

As a result, by the early 1800s, most priests were foreigners.



is that detailed enough

[Nonon]

@dacs:

i'm sure your familiar with "GOMBURZA"....Fr. Mariano Gomez, Fr. Jose Burgos and Fr. Jacinto Zamora....

they were Filipino priest who were executed because the Spanish Friars had no one to blame about the Cavite Mutiny in 1872....

they were unjustly executed because of racial reasons....

what else would the Spanish Friars do? blame Spanish Priests?

[FK]

but....the issue here is "if we will allow gays and lesbians to church leaders"....and it is "before they even started to lead"....

would you like your leader to say "Magtinihik ta kay walay kwarta ang companya"... but yet nag-gasto siya diri wala og too, is he/she considered as a good leader?

[Nonon]

@dacs:

do you know what the Spanish Friars did in order to maintain their power over us

they did not teach us their language...and instead they learned our language...in order for us not to undestand them and for them to understand us...so that they can prevent any upheavals....

and they didn't believe that "indios" are capable of learning....that is why "public schools" were established only during the american colonization...

[Nonon]

but....the issue here is "if we will allow gays and lesbians to church leaders"....and it is "before they even started to lead"....

would you like your leader to say "Magtinihik ta kay walay kwarta ang companya"... but yet nag-gasto siya diri wala og too, is he/she considered as a good leader?

of course i would consider him to be a bad leader...

but that is a different issue you are trying to address...

the real issue is "if we will allow gays and lesbian to be church leaders"....

and for me...i don't find enough reasons not to let them have the chance....

my stand in this topic remains "PRO"