Celdran found guilty in ‘Damaso’

[tingkagol]

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Aquino seeks forgiveness for Celdran | Inquirer News

I still think the media is making a huge spectacle about how he was jailed specifically for "offending religious feelings". I was actually led to believe it at first, but after following the story a bit, I now know this simply isn't true. That, yes, he offended religious feelings, but he wasn't jailed because of it but because he stepped into private property and proceeded to ridicule the property owner and its constituents.

The problem is, the media is skewing public perception by reporting that he was jailed solely because he offended some priests and church-goers. The sad thing is people are buying into the misconception (or is it just me? lol)- that they can actually be jailed if you offend the religious even in the right venue. Whether intentional or not, the media still likes controversies. But maybe they couldn't look past the title "offending the religious feelings" of article 133 of the rpc, the content of which states that the offender should be "in a place devoted to religious worship or during the celebration of any religious ceremony".

The title of that article is misleading. I suggest renaming it to "misconduct in a religious venue".

[newbie.86]

@letsee! , monroy, Bricksand, noy.juan :


Nganong bitter man? lol.


The Church was offended. They went through justice and they won.


Ka-simple ra ang issue diri: RESPECT.

Ka-simple ra aning problemaha. DILI tungod naa mo'y right to express, naa na mo'y right nga MANGBABOY or MAGBINASTOS mo. It was the SECULAR court who handed the sentence, dili ang simbahan.


You cant just go inside my house and disturb my peace. Otherwise, I have all the means against you.

Dont TWIST simple logic with complicated philosophies, spouting fundamentalism blah blah etc and other nonsense.



RIZAL INDEED HAS MORE CLASS THAN HE DOES.



Now you are complaining that the Church meddled in his conviction.

Do you have evidence?

THEN SHOW IT. Not just empty talk.

[monroy]

it was the church itself who filed the case against him so whats this stupid question on whether the church meddles in his conviction? thats a retarded question because it was the church who filed the case not the government!

as to the independence of the courts regarding religious matters i urge you to study our laws carefully. many of the laws, **including this one** were passed at the behest of the church, this law in particular was passed at a time when the state and the church were one and the same. there were no secular courts when the revised penal code was drafted under spanish rule. secondly, on matters like marriage and annulments the courts defer to the church when rendering their decisions. secular courts - yea right in this country? you're dreaming. this is not the free and democratic country they taught you in school about. we are still a semi-democratic nation under the thumb of religious extremism. the way most posters here post shows they simply don't understand what truly democratic system demands. as i said before if you're going to protect religious feelings above freedom of expression, fine, but quit pretending our country champions freedom or democracy because that's blatantly false and laughable to countries that practice true democracy as opposed to the fake one we have.

the law is oppressive and anti-democratic. or lets call this law and the jailing of celdran freedom loving and democratic even if its a lie just to satisfy the church! copy russia paste philippines.. lol

[SioDenz]

If these priests will continue persecuting Celdran, it will be a bad image for the catholic church.its like they are "digging their own grave".
"kung ang mga pari na rapists & molesters pinapatawd nila.bakit si Celdran sa kasong religious offense lang ay kinukulong!
is there something wrong with our Judicial system!

If imu sad na i allow, makahatag nag religious conflict kay relgion may gihisgutan ana. If atung i allow nga pwedi raman diay ta mang bastos sa bisag kinsa religion tunga tunga sa Misa. Mas Bad pa nuon sa tibuok nasud. Wa laing pinaka kuyaw nga sinugdanan sa kagubot kundi ang kagubot tungod sa Religion. Mao bitaw uban nasud stricto kaayu na sila anang religious tolerance. Try daw ing ana inside a Mosque during sa ilang worship if Makaayu bah.

[SioDenz]

Say what you want to say about about Celdran's foolishness. It's not about the dress and the hated Damaso character, it is that the Catholic Church should not interfere in the state's affairs.

Celdran is indeed full of hate that time, but what about the Catholic Church's disrespect on "Separation of Church and State"?

Its all about pang bastos sa tawo or mga tawo nga wa nimu ganahi ug imung gibuhat sa Dili insakto nga lugar ug panahon. Mao ra jud na ang naka deperensya dha.

[monroy]

btw, @newbie: where do you get your definition of freedom of expression? in most democratic countries, freedom of expression does include the right to offend. thats why neo-nazi protesters in europe can't be arrested for protesting against jews. sure, offensive speech sucks but it's still a part of freedom of expression.

[monroy]

If imu sad na i allow, makahatag nag religious conflict kay relgion may gihisgutan ana. If atung i allow nga pwedi raman diay ta mang bastos sa bisag kinsa religion tunga tunga sa Misa. Mas Bad pa nuon sa tibuok nasud. Wa laing pinaka kuyaw nga sinugdanan sa kagubot kundi ang kagubot tungod sa Religion. Mao bitaw uban nasud stricto kaayu na sila anang religious tolerance. Try daw ing ana inside a Mosque during sa ilang worship if Makaayu bah.

if you are saying we should follow the example of islamists and adopt an extremist mindset, then i got to disagree with you. allowing the church to use laws like this that were passed during a time when priests had the power over life and death endangers our already limited freedoms.

[SioDenz]

if you are saying we should follow the example of islamists and adopt an extremist mindset, then i got to disagree with you. allowing the church to use laws like this that were passed during a time when priests had the power over life and death endangers our already limited freedoms.

Ikaw ra mismo ni sulti sa word USE. Meaning dili ang Simbahan nagnunay ug himu sa Trial, Dili pari ang Judge, dili ang Simbahan nagpadakop, ug Dili ang simbahan maoy nag decision. Ang Balaod sa ang naghimu. Nganu ipariha man nimu sa una?
Nya nganung napasar man ang RH bill if ang simbahan karun pariha pa ug power sa unang panahon?

Nganu muabot nman kag Extremist mindset? what i mean is Dunay daghan Medium unsaon natu pagpaabot atung Kasagmuyo sa uban tawo, Dunay Allowed ug legal nga paagi nga di ta makalapas sa Katungod sa uban tawo.

Murag kanang mang bastos sa Misa nya magpadayag sa iyang gibate without considering sa Right sa uban mao na para nko ang Extremist mindset.

[monroy]

Ikaw ra mismo ni sulti sa word USE. Meaning dili ang Simbahan nagnunay ug himu sa Trial, Dili pari ang Judge, dili ang Simbahan nagpadakop, ug Dili ang simbahan maoy nag decision. Ang Balaod sa ang naghimu. Nganu ipariha man nimu sa una?
Nya nganung napasar man ang RH bill if ang simbahan karun pariha pa ug power sa unang panahon?

Nganu muabot nman kag Extremist mindset? what i mean is Dunay daghan Medium unsaon natu pagpaabot atung Kasagmuyo sa uban tawo, Dunay Allowed ug legal nga paagi nga di ta makalapas sa Katungod sa uban tawo.

Murag kanang mang bastos sa Misa nya magpadayag sa iyang gibate without considering sa Right sa uban mao na para nko ang Extremist mindset.

I didn't say it's alright to be rude in Church and I don't condone what Celdran did. I've said that many times before so you can stop going around in circles repeating the same stuff that has no relevance to my post. What I said was that in a democratic society, the balance between freedom of expression and religious feelings should be tilted in favor of freedom of expression. Religious feelings shouldn't be ignored but our laws and penalties should reflect a bias in favor of the right to free speech while at the same time discouraging offensive speech. Any amount of jailtime for what is largely a victimless crime violates human rights. Your reasoning is the same one Islamic terrorists use whenever they have their violent reactions because they felt offended.

I don't condone jaywalking or spitting on the streets but does that mean I should support jailtime for such minor crimes? Whether you support these draconian laws or not depends on how much you understand the balance needed in a democratic country.

[rickflag]

Now I read from yahoo news CBCP is planning to launch a "Morality Vote". I thought they were following Christ teaching about forgiveness, but they acted like a bunch of sore losers already. I guess they are in panic mood now because catholics does not heed their calls because there are more independent thinkers now as compared to centuries ago.