MERGED: All About RP-US Mutual Defense Treaty/ VFA-MLSA and Related Issues

[want2binvolve]

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well it's good news to some, but bad news to others na d kalihok sa ila suspicious operations if naa cla...

[SPRINGFIELD_XD_40]

@ NOY.JUAN ....

Mao ga libog gyud ko aning RYAN YU kay lagpas man kaayo .

Its not going anywhere because OT man so just ocntinue the topic about AMERICAN BASES .

[noy.juan]

@ NOY.JUAN ....

Mao ga libog gyud ko aning RYAN YU kay lagpas man kaayo .

Its not going anywhere because OT man so just ocntinue the topic about AMERICAN BASES .

mao lagi... anyways...

bottom line is... US have no plans to set another base.. its been a hype sa mga meeja if they see ranking US official visiting former bases... they always speculate that amirikans are coming back...

look at this point of view... which is more practical create a new base or just house your troop on a hosts nation base?, currently this is what the amirikans did in the south...

and also dapat sad ninyo i considered that its on our constitution....

[gareb]

where was i? oh yes...

For obvious reasons it would not be that of a preparation competent enough to protect us from China , but definitely for internal conflicts like what you said, we don't have the means for large scale war.

precisely. that is why it is stupid to even think that the VFA as it is now can ever post as a deterrent to an aggressive China.

A clean 10 man specops commando can eliminate the ASG in less than half an hour for good if they want to lang as an example.

the mind boggling thing is that it is never done, i think, because of two reasons; 1.) kidnapping and ASG's brand of terror is big business not only to them but of local politicos, warlords, etc. 2.) a hero always needs an enemy to look cool.

Each of these has its own pros and cons , what you stated are only the cons . How about the PROS?

If they are after for what you thought of , I dont see any problem with that personally . What difference it would really make sa MLSA compare sa 2 ka actual bases before ?

the PRO's of potentially converting each island of an entire archipelago into a temporary military base as the need presents itself? whoever would try and think of it without bearing in mind the actual humanitarian, economic and environmental cost to that has got to be kidding.

imagine displaced communities everywhere. we are not just talking about barangays, but entire municipalities uprooted because the area is being turned into a "temporary military base". multiply the effect to how many other municipalities affected in how many other islands. add to that the possible economic and environmental damage; trees uprooted, rice fields leveled, entire local economies going to an abrupt halt.

one might ask where are these scenarios now when MLSA has been approved? when one allows the possibility of these scenarios by allowing it on paper, what is there to legally stop it from happening?

precedent? consider Daniel Smith's case. the VFA allowed it to happen, so it did.

Everytime I apply for work , regardless if I have these or not , I still undergo training whats suitable for the work I am into maski of the same nature pa siya .

the fact that those things happen is not even an issue. of course you need to be trained for the specifics that your work requires you to do. but the kind of training that they need to service what is required by the US troops would likely have the US send out batch after batch of pinoys back to the US for some sophisticated training. they can't just pick anybody out from the streets and mass-employ them to repair tanks and ships, among other things. this is the reason why i say the employment prospects of a huge number of pinoys in this area is negligible.

What am I asking about the MLSA issue here is say we supply them ammunition . Mo dawat kaha sila ug bala mde by ARMSCOR ?

you are the one who knows more about these things; you should be the one telling me how bogus the entire agreement is in that aspect.

Naay brig sulod sa embassy bai. That is meant for those American citizens ( military or civilian ) working in the embassy or by any way connected to the state . The reason for these are for fair trial at its finest and real justice .

for sure what they have in there is way better than Bilibid. we see the innocence of Daniel Smith with the benefit of hindsight. an innocent should in no way be punished for a crime he/she did not commit. still, law should be served equally, and sentences should not just be a mere "pat on the hand" just because he is protected by the dubious lines on the VFA.

and regardless of the issue and scenario , maski guilty pa ang subject .... why did our government agree with the agreement since these laws being implemented is part of the VFA agreement ? When Anti American rally and shout " GET OUT U.S. FORCES " , might as well include also " GET OUT PHILIPPINE GOVERNMENT " since kunsabo man kaha ni ang duha .

the US has leverage the corrupt in high government cannot resist. i'm talking about loans, credit ratings, availability of needed investment capital, access to a voracious consumer market; all of which our artificially dependent economy cannot live without. without a floating economy, the power-base of the local elite will crumble. and that is something that they do not want to see.

oh, no need to worry about them shouting anti-government slogans. you'd be deaf if you can't hear it. and what colorful effigies they burn in the streets.

True .... we survived right for another 20 or more years . But my question is , was our quality of life is better or worst compared 20 years or so ago ? generally speaking na lang ni ha because we will end as deep as panahon sa martial law man hehehe . What is worst , our debt is getting bigger , mahug ang interest ra ng gibayaran nato .

again, i have to mention that ours is an "artifically dependent" economy. unless drastic things are done, it will just stay as it is and gradually worsen. but this topic should be for another thread altogether.

The point I am empahsizing is the issue of HAZMAT and not who is responsible for it . If the Subic and Clark bases are manned by the Philippine Navy and Airforce respectively , do we see any struggle fights , top of the world voicing outs etc ? maybe or maybe not but I am inclined to believed na wala . Sad but true , Americans maybe be capitalist but Filipinos are OPPURTUNIST

but someone has to be responsible. and the biggest responsibility is on the shoulders of who left those hazarodus materials. it becomes a big issue simply because the US military left those materials outside the borders of its territorial sovereignty. not only that, it has affected the living conditions of people in that area. an international issue is always a bigger issue that something that happens locally, this is something that should be plainly apparent.

a similar incident involving the Philippine Navy and the Philippine Army might invoke condemnations, but most probably would not escalate itself to the US Congress, simply because it is the least of their concerns.

what should be remembered is that if the US government cannot just leave its hazardous materials anywhere within the 50 sates, there should be less reasons to throw away these materials on a neighbor's backyard, much less leave it on a military base that they use to occupy.

Anyways , its never too late . Something can still be done but definitely its not the ANTI AMERICANS who can solve the problems .

but curiously, however you see them, they seem to be at the forefront of pointing out how crazy the VFA is, how silly the idea bringing back the military bases is, and how stupid can a government be in considering, much less agreeing to this entire thing.

not to mention how foolish we can be to elect such politicians.

[tackielarla]

I heard a news this morning regarding the american, wants to bring US military bases here in the Philippines, is this a good idea or not?...

share your opinion...

They never really left bruh...

[dmcebu01]

if tinuod man ni......para sa akua its BAD kay mograbe naman sad ang PROSTITUSYON sa PINAS......Kahibaw baya mo anang mga KANO hilig kaau sa Babae.....
Pero on the other hand ok cguro cya in terms sa ECONOMY na2....

makatanag ni sa depensa sa PILIPINAS ug ang CHINA nagpadu ol na sa PILIPINAS ila ng gi angkon ang isla nga wala gyud silay labot, I WOULD say YES!!! Pabalika ddaghang trabaho ang mahimo sab ani. Striktuhon lang ang Prostitution sa SUBIC. Pero kaning new generation of US Military are more disciplined compare sa una, meaning di na nipataka sa mga babaye natu kay kong maka pamabdos ni sila obligasyon gyud nila makahatag ug child support.

[makal34]

MANILA, Philippines (AP) — In a highly symbolic ceremony aboard a guided-missile destroyer Wednesday, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton underscored America's military and diplomatic backing for the Philippines as it engages in an increasingly tense territorial dispute with China in the resource-rich South China Sea.
On board the USS Fitzgerald in Manila Bay, Clinton and Philippine Foreign Secretary Albert del Rosario signed a declaration calling for multilateral talks to resolve maritime disputes such as those in the South China Sea, contrasting China's policy of negotiating one-on-one with the Philippines and other Asian claimants.
"The United States does not take any position on any territorial claim," Clinton said after meeting with President Benigno Aquino III. But Clinton told a forum with young students that Washington is "very strongly against any nation using coercion or intimidation instead of using the law to try to resolve these issues."
Clinton flew later Wednesday to Thailand, where she announced a $10 million aid package for the flood-stricken country. She planned to visit a flood victims evacuation center on Thursday.
Clinton said her discussions with Philippine officials focused on strengthening the Philippines' defense "to have a credible deterrent, to be able to protect what is yours and to be able to pursue lawful activities, whether it's for fishing or exploration for gas and oil."
The Philippines and Vietnam have accused Chinese vessels of repeatedly intruding into areas they claim in the potentially oil-rich Spratly Islands in the South China Sea and of trying to sabotage oil explorations in their territorial waters. China has denied the allegations, saying it has sovereignty over the vast sea.
"We are making sure that our collective defense capabilities and communications infrastructure are operationally and materially capable of deterring provocations," Clinton said aboard the Fitzgerald, a U.S. Navy vessel that has operated in the South China Sea.
Del Rosario urged the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, which includes the Philippines, Vietnam and two other claimant countries, on Tuesday to host an unprecedented meeting of countries embroiled in the Spratly dispute. Beijing opposed any multilateral discussion of the issue, including at an East Asian summit this week in Bali, Indonesia, to be attended by President Barack Obama and other world leaders.
Defying China, Clinton said the U.S. "will certainly expect and participate in very open and frank discussions," including on the maritime challenges in the region.
The Manila Declaration signed by Clinton and del Rosario commemorated the 60th anniversary of the allies' Mutual Defense Treaty. It calls for "maintaining freedom of navigation, unimpeded lawful commerce, and transit of people across the seas."
Asked if intensified U.S. military aid would mean sending more troops to the Philippines, Clinton did not clearly reply but said any future deployments would be temporary, citing local sensitivities.
Dozens of left-wing activists calling for the abrogation of a treaty that allows U.S. troop and ship visits to the country hurled red paint on part of her convoy, and a student unfurled an anti-treaty poster and heckled Clinton as she spoke at the forum with young students.
Asked about the convoy incident, State Department spokesman Mark Toner said a crowd of 40 or 50 protesters hurled eggs, paint-filled baloons and maybe a few rocks but no one was hurt. The vehicle in which Clinton was traveling was not hit, he said.
In addition to China, the Philippines and Vietnam, the Spratlys are also claimed by Taiwan, Malaysia and Brunei. The dispute has been feared as Asia's next flash point for conflict.
The U.S. has angered China by saying it has a stake in security and unhampered international commerce in the South China Sea. China says American involvement will only complicate the issue.
The Philippines, whose poorly equipped forces are no match for China's powerful military, has resorted to diplomatic protests and turned to Washington for support. Aquino has insisted his country won't be bullied by China.
A senior U.S. State Department official traveling with Clinton told reporters that America's military assistance to the Philippines will increasingly shift to bolstering its naval power.
For nearly a decade, the U.S. military has been providing counterterrorism training, weapons and intelligence to help Filipino troops battle al-Qaida-linked groups in the nation's south. Those include the Abu Sayyaf, a small but violent group listed by Washington as a terrorist organization, and its allied militants from the Indonesia-based Jemaah Islamiyah group.
"We are now in the process ... of diversifying and changing the nature of our engagement," the U.S. official said Tuesday on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information. "We will continue those efforts in the south, but we are focusing more on maritime capabilities and other aspects of expeditionary military power."
The U.S. recently provided the Philippines with a destroyer, and the official said a second one will be delivered soon.

[makal34]

[The_Patriot]

MANILA, Philippines (AP) — In a highly symbolic ceremony aboard a guided-missile destroyer Wednesday, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton underscored America's military and diplomatic backing for the Philippines as it engages in an increasingly tense territorial dispute with China in the resource-rich South China Sea.

On board the USS Fitzgerald in Manila Bay, Clinton and Philippine Foreign Secretary Albert del Rosario signed a declaration calling for multilateral talks to resolve maritime disputes such as those in the South China Sea, contrasting China's policy of negotiating one-on-one with the Philippines and other Asian claimants.
"The United States does not take any position on any territorial claim," Clinton said after meeting with President Benigno Aquino III. But Clinton told a forum with young students that Washington is "very strongly against any nation using coercion or intimidation instead of using the law to try to resolve these issues."

Discussions between U.S. and Philippine officials focused on strengthening the Philippines' defense "to have a credible deterrent, to be able to protect what is yours and to be able to pursue lawful activities, whether it's for fishing or exploration for gas and oil," she said.

The Philippines and Vietnam have accused Chinese vessels of repeatedly intruding into areas they claim in the potentially oil-rich Spratly Islands in the South China Sea and of trying to sabotage oil explorations in their territorial waters. China has denied the allegations, saying it has sovereignty over the vast sea.
"We are making sure that our collective defense capabilities and communications infrastructure are operationally and materially capable of deterring provocations," Clinton said aboard the Fitzgerald, a U.S. Navy vessel that has operated in the South China Sea.

Del Rosario urged the Association of Southeast Asian Nations, which includes the Philippines, Vietnam and two other claimant countries, on Tuesday to host an unprecedented meeting of countries embroiled in the Spratly dispute. Beijing opposed any multilateral discussion of the issue, including at an East Asian summit this week in Bali, Indonesia, to be attended by President Barack Obama and other world leaders.
Defying China, Clinton said the U.S. "will certainly expect and participate in very open and frank discussions," including on the maritime challenges in the region.

The Manila Declaration signed by Clinton and del Rosario commemorated the 60th anniversary of the allies' Mutual Defense Treaty. It calls for "maintaining freedom of navigation, unimpeded lawful commerce, and transit of people across the seas."

Asked if intensified U.S. military aid would mean sending more troops to the Philippines, Clinton did not clearly reply but said any future deployments would be temporary, citing local sensitivities.

Dozens of left-wing activists calling for the abrogation of a treaty that allows U.S. troop and ship visits to the country hurled red paint on part of her convoy, and a student unfurled an anti-treaty poster and heckled Clinton as she spoke at the forum with young students.
In addition to China, the Philippines and Vietnam, the Spratlys are also claimed by Taiwan, Malaysia and Brunei. The dispute has been feared as Asia's next flash point for conflict.

The U.S. has angered China by saying it has a stake in security and unhampered international commerce in the South China Sea. China says American involvement will only complicate the issue.

The Philippines, whose poorly equipped forces are no match for China's powerful military, has resorted to diplomatic protests and turned to Washington for support. Aquino has insisted his country won't be bullied by China.

A senior U.S. State Department official traveling with Clinton told reporters that America's military assistance to the Philippines will increasingly shift to bolstering its naval power.

For nearly a decade, the U.S. military has been providing counterterrorism training, weapons and intelligence to help Filipino troops battle al-Qaida-linked groups in the nation's south. Those include the Abu Sayyaf, a small but violent group listed by Washington as a terrorist organization, and its allied militants from the Indonesia-based Jemaah Islamiyah group.

"We are now in the process ... of diversifying and changing the nature of our engagement," the U.S. official said Tuesday on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the information. "We will continue those efforts in the south, but we are focusing more on maritime capabilities and other aspects of expeditionary military power."

The U.S. recently provided the Philippines with a destroyer, and the official said a second one will be delivered soon.

http://news.yahoo.com/us-philippines...amid-row-china

[The_Patriot]

Praise to the continues relationship of U.S. and Philippines...

Let us defend our territory and continue to develop our military...

Americans are for Filipinos and Filipinos are for Americans,

God bless the Americans... God bless the Philippines!

Stop the false accusation against U.S. that bring division.

By: PHILIPPINE INDEPENDENT CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIAN MOVEMENT.

No to corruption and No to immorality! Jesus Saves Philippines.