Tallo leaves Ateneo: Right or Wrong Move?

[Jumperman]

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Nope, Juami Tiongson went straight to the Hail Mary Squad/Team A after graduating HS in 2008. I also actually stand corrected in a previous post, Oping had a stint with Glory Be in his first year (2006). I had thought he came to Loyola in 2007.

I'm saying this with all due respect sir, I'm not speaking for anyone else but myself in this thread. I'm not trying to get into an argument with you either, because clearly you are more in the loop than I am. I'm just trying to put myself in Mark Jayven's shoes to better understand why he/his folks came to the decision to leave (because I really don't want to believe that NU or some other school was trying to "submarine" him).

I'm not disputing that Ateneo had plans for Mark Jayven. I'm pretty sure he figured in Coach Norman's grand scheme of things for the future. I also agree that he isn't as ready as Kiefer is to deserve the same minutes. But then again, like I mentioned in a previous post, it was never about becoming an instant star. I want to believe that it was his being BOLTED to the bench that did things in. He never saw any time on the court. Even a very jittery and perhaps un-ready Chris Tiu back in his first season was sent in occasionally, even had a very memorable play where he bungled a wide-open fastbreak lay-up. That's how players gain confidence. I agree that the way he reacted may have been premature and juvenile considering it was only the pre-season, but more often than not the pre-season lineups used are the ones Coach Norman will usually utilize during the actual course of the UAAP. If a guy isn't seeing action even in the pre-season (where no one takes things seriously), how much more in the actual season where the stakes are at its highest? I think had Mark Jayven been given even a quarter of the quality minutes being given to some of the regulars he wouldn't have elected to leave. His asking for PT has been greatly misconstrued as wanting to be a main cog immediately, and that's why I pity the guy. Again, the Tallos could've handled it in a more professional manner, but the damage has been done. We can only hope they patch things up eventually.

I'm not disputing the fact that Manila is really where the action is, what I am pining for is that the Cebu leagues will be just as competitive. I totally agree with the idea of sending Cebu teams to join the FMC or the Fil-Oil tourneys. And I was not suggesting a "shortcut benefactor". What I meant was that it'd be a big difference if, say USC had a rich patron like Ateneo has in MVP who is willing to fund the basketball team. Maybe they can send the coaching staff to camps to try to get better and acquire new skills, send the team to train in the US, improve the facilities, etc. If that happened, they could even compete with the big universities here in Manila in the recruitment wars. It'd be great to see Cebu basketball on the same plane as it is here in Manila. Again, a pipe dream, but it'd be nice if it happened.

[cjpadriga]

asa najud duwa ci tallo?

[alexnowz]

Since ni hawa na si Tallo... mao kuno ni ilang i-puli nga recruit..



LOL.

ataya aning dwight ui.. nag ateneo blue eagles naman.. hahaha

[bb2]

Nope, Juami Tiongson went straight to the Hail Mary Squad/Team A after graduating HS in 2008. I also actually stand corrected in a previous post, Oping had a stint with Glory Be in his first year (2006). I had thought he came to Loyola in 2007.

I'm saying this with all due respect sir, I'm not speaking for anyone else but myself in this thread. I'm not trying to get into an argument with you either, because clearly you are more in the loop than I am. I'm just trying to put myself in Mark Jayven's shoes to better understand why he/his folks came to the decision to leave (because I really don't want to believe that NU or some other school was trying to "submarine" him).

I'm not disputing that Ateneo had plans for Mark Jayven. I'm pretty sure he figured in Coach Norman's grand scheme of things for the future. I also agree that he isn't as ready as Kiefer is to deserve the same minutes. But then again, like I mentioned in a previous post, it was never about becoming an instant star. I want to believe that it was his being BOLTED to the bench that did things in. He never saw any time on the court. Even a very jittery and perhaps un-ready Chris Tiu back in his first season was sent in occasionally, even had a very memorable play where he bungled a wide-open fastbreak lay-up. That's how players gain confidence. I agree that the way he reacted may have been premature and juvenile considering it was only the pre-season, but more often than not the pre-season lineups used are the ones Coach Norman will usually utilize during the actual course of the UAAP. If a guy isn't seeing action even in the pre-season (where no one takes things seriously), how much more in the actual season where the stakes are at its highest? I think had Mark Jayven been given even a quarter of the quality minutes being given to some of the regulars he wouldn't have elected to leave. His asking for PT has been greatly misconstrued as wanting to be a main cog immediately, and that's why I pity the guy. Again, the Tallos could've handled it in a more professional manner, but the damage has been done. We can only hope they patch things up eventually.

I'm not disputing the fact that Manila is really where the action is, what I am pining for is that the Cebu leagues will be just as competitive. I totally agree with the idea of sending Cebu teams to join the FMC or the Fil-Oil tourneys. And I was not suggesting a "shortcut benefactor". What I meant was that it'd be a big difference if, say USC had a rich patron like Ateneo has in MVP who is willing to fund the basketball team. Maybe they can send the coaching staff to camps to try to get better and acquire new skills, send the team to train in the US, improve the facilities, etc. If that happened, they could even compete with the big universities here in Manila in the recruitment wars. It'd be great to see Cebu basketball on the same plane as it is here in Manila. Again, a pipe dream, but it'd be nice if it happened.

My apologies for being wrong about Tiongson. I will say his play has disappointed me. Whether that is indecisiveness, lack of playing time, or just having a guy who has tried harder and has become a better player than him (Monfort) ahead of him is guess work. The bottom line is you have to earn PT. Maybe the Coach thought that after Tallo shows that he has the discipline by adding the 10 pounds that was the goal he would give him PT. Again that is all guess work. You could even argue the other way. The Blue Eagles have invested so much in Tiongson that they have kept him around on Team A despite not having a great impact.

Let me ask again the crucial question........did the Tallos' aside from that brief talk with Coach Norman in and around the Mapua game bother to reach out to Coach Norman, Paolo Trillo, or Jack Huang to ask what the plans were?

Any normal person who has trouble/problems with "persons in authority" would ask.

Let me ask you, would it be normal for a person with a problem with another just to leave without trying to seriously talk about it. The Mapua talk was in and around a game. I'm sure Coach Norman had a lot on his mind, it was an important game for the FMC. MacMac with a ticket booked had already had a pre-disposition before that talk.

Let's call it what it is....an "AWOL". Circumstances show the true character of the people in how they handle things.

Let's just hope that he shows better character the rest of his life.

Re: Patron. I am sure Mr. Augusto Go is supporting his team quite well. I know people who work for him and they say he backs his students,faculty, and staff. without reservation. I talk to Mr. Andrew Aznar every so often and he is proud of his bball program.

Ateneo has a lot to thank for in MVP but it still needs the rooted support of hardcore Alumni. Who nurtured MacMac to Ateneo? A Cebu Alumni. Who brought Poy Erram from CdO? People from Xavier. Even Pearce who eventually did not make it to the Blue Eagles was found and nurtured by others. I have friends who are middle-class income workers in Manila. However when they see a Team B player of the Blue Eagles during a game they treat him out to dinner after as a show of support. When the Ateneo Alumni Association Cebu has excess funds from some of their projects they partly spent for a trip for the Blue Eagles 2 years ago to come to Cebu for an appreciation dinner. The rest was sponsored by by the training funds for their games against local Cebu Teams.

How are the Cebu Alumni of the local schools showing support?

[kobe24]

nagkita me ni tallo ganiha sure na daw moduwa cya

[bb2]

nagkita me ni tallo ganiha sure na daw moduwa cya

Great to hear he has found a college.

Having it be a Cebu school shows that either he wants to continue to be a big fish in a small pond or the Manila schools have lost interest. I hope that works out for him.

[inc-pankz]

asa sya duwa

[vipvip68]

Great to hear he has found a college.

Having it be a Cebu school shows that either he wants to continue to be a big fish in a small pond or the Manila schools have lost interest. I hope that works out for him.

Big fish in a small pond gyud. Now he can hog all the attention, be the superstar and get all the playing time he wants.... Maybe thats what he and his dad wanted all along.

[digitalsuperman]

nagkita me ni tallo ganiha sure na daw moduwa cya

sure na gyud nga SWU siya muduwa?

[Jumperman]

My apologies for being wrong about Tiongson. I will say his play has disappointed me. Whether that is indecisiveness, lack of playing time, or just having a guy who has tried harder and has become a better player than him (Monfort) ahead of him is guess work. The bottom line is you have to earn PT. Maybe the Coach thought that after Tallo shows that he has the discipline by adding the 10 pounds that was the goal he would give him PT. Again that is all guess work. You could even argue the other way. The Blue Eagles have invested so much in Tiongson that they have kept him around on Team A despite not having a great impact.

Let me ask again the crucial question........did the Tallos' aside from that brief talk with Coach Norman in and around the Mapua game bother to reach out to Coach Norman, Paolo Trillo, or Jack Huang to ask what the plans were?

Any normal person who has trouble/problems with "persons in authority" would ask.

Let me ask you, would it be normal for a person with a problem with another just to leave without trying to seriously talk about it. The Mapua talk was in and around a game. I'm sure Coach Norman had a lot on his mind, it was an important game for the FMC. MacMac with a ticket booked had already had a pre-disposition before that talk.

Let's call it what it is....an "AWOL". Circumstances show the true character of the people in how they handle things.

Let's just hope that he shows better character the rest of his life.

Re: Patron. I am sure Mr. Augusto Go is supporting his team quite well. I know people who work for him and they say he backs his students,faculty, and staff. without reservation. I talk to Mr. Andrew Aznar every so often and he is proud of his bball program.

Ateneo has a lot to thank for in MVP but it still needs the rooted support of hardcore Alumni. Who nurtured MacMac to Ateneo? A Cebu Alumni. Who brought Poy Erram from CdO? People from Xavier. Even Pearce who eventually did not make it to the Blue Eagles was found and nurtured by others. I have friends who are middle-class income workers in Manila. However when they see a Team B player of the Blue Eagles during a game they treat him out to dinner after as a show of support. When the Ateneo Alumni Association Cebu has excess funds from some of their projects they partly spent for a trip for the Blue Eagles 2 years ago to come to Cebu for an appreciation dinner. The rest was sponsored by by the training funds for their games against local Cebu Teams.

How are the Cebu Alumni of the local schools showing support?

I wish I knew the answers to all the questions regarding the events that led to the eventual departure. Don't want to make negative speculations. We can only hope these are just sabotage stories and that it was really all about frustration on the Tallos' part.

Call him a big fish in a small pond, pero bisag asa pa na si Mark Jayven mu-duwa, I'm sure he has the potential to stand out. Pa-hanas nalang sa siya sa Cebu (kung magpa-bilin ba gyud siya diha), but hopefully another school gives him a chance to play in the UAAP. Maayo sad unta kat-on na ang mga Tallo sa nahitabo karon.

Yep, it's actually crazy how fanatical alumni in Manila (not just Ateneo) are for their alma mater. Dili lang ingon nga ang proud ra kaayo kay ang Ateneo or La Salle community, bisag ang mga students sa NU, UE, Arellano, etc., schools that people easily brand as "cheap", "baduy", or "jologs", they come to the games and are genuinely proud and happy that they belong to their respective schools, not just when they win. That's yet another thing that we don't see in Cebu. I'm not belittling the support that is being given by Augusto Go and the Aznars for their respective schools, but I guess they can only do so much. The alumni, at least some, are also trying to help. Let's not forget that it was Greg Slaughter's uncle, a UV alumnus, who brought the big man to the Green Lancer fold. Sadly, it's not as consistent as the support being displayed here in the big(ger) city. I wish Cebu schools would develop school spirit more, it seems it's not very high on their respective lists/school agendas. I guess the quality of education should improve as well, so that when it comes to choosing schools, the prospects and their parents wouldn't have any qualms about staying home. Ka-lami ra sa kinabuhi sa Cebu ah, ka-hassle ra diri sa Manila. But that sentiment is better suited in another topic/thread.